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Some students and clients in the community are struggling. They’re getting deals under contract, but they're not selling them. There are a few things going on here, but you’ve got to learn how to negotiate with sellers. People are struggling because they're getting a property under contract, and they're waiting too long, hoping to get the price that they want. You’re probably offering way too much or you’re not being aggressive enough in your negotiations with sellers to get them down to their price. 

So how do you solve this problem? You have to become the reluctant buyer instead of the motivated buyer. When you stop chasing sellers, they start coming to you. You have to play tough. Don't let them walk over you. Don't let them tell you how it's going to work. You tell them how it's going to work. Here, I take a couple of questions from the community, do a little role playing, and show you what it looks like to be that reluctant buyer.

Listen and learn:

What’s inside:

  • Why you don’t want to be a motivated buyer
  • How to get tough with sellers and become a reluctant buyer
  • A role play to help you talk to sellers

Mentioned in this episode:

Download episode transcript in PDF format here…

Joe:   What's up everybody? I want to. Good morning everybody. Hey, if you could please type in the, chat or actually, I'm going to do a poll here in zoom. How many, conversations have you had in the last week with sellers? And how many offers to be made in the last week? Type that in there and I'm going to, open up something here. This is really important when I'm going to be telling you guys today and I want everybody to pay attention, I'm going to give you some books. First. Let's look at this poll. I share the results with you here. Cool. So, I mean, this is this is good. 38% of you have had over five conversations. No, 37 being 69% of 69% of you have had over five conversations. It's awesome and offers nice. You see that I love it. 50, 63, 76, 76% of you have made over seven offers. I love it. Good. All right. I want to share something with you guys on a I want you. You have some homework. I want you guys. Let me open this up here. I want you guys to get these three books. Or if you have to choose one, I'm going to give them an order of importance. And I'll put the links to these in the zoom chat. Let me share my screen. The first book I want you to get: Go for No. All right. I'm gonna put it in the zoom chat. Go for No. And the next one is Flip the Script. Flip the Script. Put that in the zoom chat and the next one Never Split the Difference. Great book, Never Split the Difference. These two three books here now number one to be probably Go for No, it won't take you long to read. It's just 80 pages and then Flip the Script. It's, 200 pages. These. This will make the difference between you doing no deals and you doing your first deal or one deal or whatever this is.

Joe:   I've been really thinking a lot about this because some students and clients in the community, they're struggling. We're getting deals under contract, but they're not selling them. And you've got to learn how to negotiate with sellers. There's a few things that it's going on here. People are struggling because they're getting a property under contract, and they're waiting too long to hope to get the price that they want. I got so many things I want to say, but I want to try to keep this as simple as possible, as concise as possible. You're offering way too much on your deals. You're offering way too much. You're not being aggressive enough on your negotiating with sellers to get them down to their price. Just watching one client today and he is struggling with understanding this says, I've done all the work. I'm doing what I'm supposed to be doing. I'm getting this doesn't work. I'm not I can't sell these properties. Well, why can't you sell? They're just overpriced. Whose fault is that? It's. It's yours. It is. Okay, so what do you do about that? You got to be calm. Write this down. The reluctant buyer. You need to be the reluctant buyer. It's so tempting and easy to become. And I understand this. You want to do your first deal, but you become the motivated buyer. You are not the motivated buyer. You're the reluctant buyer. Do you understand the difference? Stop chasing sellers makes them come to you. The harder you chase sellers, the faster they'll run. You're still hungry to do your first deal. You're okay with just a small little $3,000 profit or $5,000 profit. You know, if you think a property would sell for 25 to $30,000, you're thinking, okay, I'm going to sell it for $30 when you need to be thinking, I'm going to sell this thing for 20,000. If you see it for the range of a. So like when you're making your offer, number one, you need to make the sellers come up with the number first. And you got to be okay with telling a listen. I'm probably not your buyer. This isn't probably this isn't going to work for me, no matter what number they tell you, or even if they don't tell you a number, you need to be the reluctant buyer. This isn't going to work for me. I'm sorry. I'm probably not your buyer. But, you know, let me ask you a few questions about your property. Okay? What's your situation? Notice I didn't say. Tell me about the property. I didn't say, would you accept $10,000 for your property? I'm going to the seller and I'm asking them, what's your situation? I don't care about the property I care about, do they? Them that their story, their situation? Do they need to sell the property or they just want to sell the property on a 1 to 10 scale? What's their motivation? Too many of you are getting deals under contract with sellers that are at a 1 to 3 motivation level. They need to be at a 7 or 10 and if not, you need to run. Make them an offer anyway. But don't chase them right and sometimes they'll refuse to give you a number. You need to be willing to walk away and say, you know what? I'm sorry. It's not going to work for me. You're not interested in telling me a number. I'm not interested in making you an offer. So are you telling me we're done? That you got to be. You got to play tough or you got to get some. Excuse me, ladies, you got to get some balls, okay? And be tougher with these sellers. Don't let them walk over you. Don't let them tell you how it's going to work. You tell them how it's going to work. Listen, you're the one with some money. You're the one with $1 million burning a hole in your pocket and hip pocket. National Bank, in your mind, you. They need to tell you why you should want to buy their property, not why and why you shouldn't buy some of the other properties down the street. You're too needy. You're too needy for a deal. You need to make them sell you on why you should want to buy their property.

Joe:   Does that make sense? I appreciate you, but you're nodding your head because you get it. So, like, you guys are too soft. You're too soft with these sellers. You're letting them dictate. The terms, the price. You know, you just need to go and say, listen and do this with every seller. I'm probably not your buyer. Why? This is a nice property. Why do you even want to sell it? You should probably listen with the realtor. So tell me, how much do you want for the property? Sounds like a nice property. I don't know why you'd want to sell it, but if you did, like, what would you sell it for? Well, that's. That number is probably not going to work for me. I'm not interested. And shut up and just listen. See what they say. You should probably listed with the realtor you listen to with an agent. Haven't you? You should listen with the realtor. Am I acting like the motivated buyer when I'm saying that? Or my acting as the reluctant buyer? Okay, do you see the big difference there? And I'm seeing people struggle with this, and they're getting deals under contract because they just give the seller whatever price the seller wants, or they're okay with just a small little $5,000 profit. But you forget that you're being too aggressive. You're not being aggressive enough on the sale price. All right. So let me share my offer spreadsheet with you here. Because this is so important that you guys understand this. Okay. Let me change your clearing list. All right? I'm gonna share this with you. Share my screen. Okay. Every time I do these Monday calls where I talk about it's the deals, deals, deals, calls, and I'm showing how to make offers, you know, on deals. It starts with this right here. Okay. What can you list the property for? You guys are not being aggressive enough with this number. What can you sell the property for. So in this example I remember the numbers exactly. But the property was probably I could see similar properties were selling for 25 grand. I'm going to price mine for 19,500. I want to get underneath that $20,000 mark and I want $10,000. Dang it. Wholesale fee. I'm not going to settle for $3,000. $5,000. I want $10,000, I deserve it. I mean, I really don't, but I'm just saying. Right. Juba deserves it. Ken deserves it. Joe. Virginia. Jerry, you deserve it. All right. I'm just being sold. Then I'm going to figure in 10% realtor commission. So I want to be generous with my commissions. If I'm paying a private investor money, I'm going to put $1,000 interest in there. I'm gonna have a factor of maybe a thousand bucks. I'm going to pay $500 for photographers. If it's in North Carolina, I want to. It's an attorney state. I'm going to put $2,000 for closing costs and boom, there's my arm for 3000 bucks. Too many of you guys are like, oh, I'll offer 9000 because of the 50% rule. Or the seller says, you know what I'll take? They tell you, I'll sell it for 5000. You got to say, no, I'm sorry. It's just not going to work for me. I'm not interested. Now I'm looking at the property here and I'm looking at satellite view. I'm looking at Street View. I'm looking at active comps and sold comps. And I'm. You can find 20 things that are wrong with the property. And you need to tell the seller, listen, I'm looking here. What? I've seen one of the neighbors, they've got a bunch of abandoned trucks in the front yard. Or I'm looking at Street View and it doesn't look like the road is paved. Is it? Are there utilities on the property yet? No. Oh, shoot. I don't think this is going to work. Is the road paved? No. Have you done a survey on it? No. Have you done a perc test? Oh, you haven't shoot. Oh! What's this? POW! What's this? What are these lines? You know, on the property. Next. All those are power pole utility lines or whatever power lines are. Shoot, I don't think is going to work for me. I'm looked in here. There's a bunch of active listings that haven't sold yet in the last six months, but I don't know if this is going to work. Like, you can find 20 things that are wrong with the property. Tell the seller I don't think it's going to work for me. What's the least you could take? Is that the best you could do? And if they won't give you a number, you need to be willing to walk and say, all right, I don't think this is going to work for you if you don't want a number, if you can't give me a number, then I'm not. I don't think I'm interested. You should just listed with an agent. I can give you the names and phone numbers of five realtors if you want.

Joe:   So I'm not being a jerk, but then I go back to. So here's the list of what would make you happy if they still won't give you number because maybe they don't know. They just honestly don't know. It's some old lady your husband just passed. He doesn't know what it's worth. So you can say, well, you know, I'm looking at I'm looking at some sold properties here that have sold for about 5000 an acre. I would I'd probably need to be in that price range. That's not going to work for you, is it? Even in my questions, I'm using negative phrasing. That's probably not going to work for you, is it? Listen, seller, I'm not a retail buyer. I'm an investor. I buy properties at big significant discounts. If you want full price, you should listen with an agent. But if you want the easy button, I can probably help you. But I'm not going to pay full price. You're okay with me making a profit, right? You're okay with me making money on this deal so I can feed my kids, my grandkids, right. So I'm telling you, read those books. Especially go for no and flip the script, because you got to get into your head that you're the reluctant buyer right now. When you get a deal under contract, immediately, you guys need to be marketing that deal like bonkers. Well, how does what you need just go call every realtor who has sold vacant land in that area. You should. Call at least 20 realtors who have sold vacant land in that area. That's number one. Number two, you should go and find all the investors that own property in that area who have bought property in the last year. Skip. Trace them, call them. Say, hey, are you looking for another deal? I've got a property here. You should call every other investor that's doing land in that area. Call them to see if they want to partner with you on a deal. I have in my course this desperate, motivated buyer letter where you're pretending to be the desperate buyer. This time you can pretend. But anyway, to be honest, this is where you are motivated buyer in a certain sense, right? But this is what you send to everybody that has bought land recently in the last 6 to 12 months. And this is a crumpled up letter. Urgent. Don't throw me away. I desperately need to sell my two acre vacant lot near city, state. Whatever. I've had it on the market and I can't wait any longer. Take a look at the attached map. Call me. I'll tell you all about it. The title is clear. Taxes are payments in great shape. I needed sold today. I'm desperate. Please call me. Make me cash offer right now in a yellow legal pad. Sharpie. Crumple it up. Fold it. Force. Put it in an invitation envelope. Hand address the envelope. Send it to 50 buyers who have bought land in that area in the last year. If you don't have 50 buyers who bought land in that area in the last year, why are you even doing any marketing there in the first place? Okay. Sometimes your deals are hard to sell because you're in crappy markets. You're in areas where nobody's buying land there. So send this up. But you should be talking to, you know, realtors, investors, neighbors, other people who are buying land, doing deals in that area. And if you're not getting any interest in your deal, maybe you put it on Facebook Marketplace. Maybe you do broker list, you get it out there. You should know within 2 to 3 weeks, four weeks max whether you have a good deal or not. And if you don't have a good deal, nobody's interested in partnering with you on the deal. If the land funding companies are not funding your deal, if they're telling you now, this isn't going to work, then you need to go back to the seller, cancel the contract. You need to go back to the seller, say, listen, I don't think it's going to work. I need to cancel this contract and shut up. Listen to them, see what they say. If they say, okay, fine, I'll just give it to my daughter. Great. Okay. Cancel that sentiment. Termination letter. Move on. Follow up with them every 30 days. Because a lot of times these sellers just need time to cook. 75% of your deals are going to come from the follow up. Send them an offer anyway. Follow up with them every 30 days because they think their property is worth this and it's not. They say I've gotten tons of letters from other investors and I've got another offers you. Why haven't you sold it to them yet? Why are we talking? I'm going for no. Why are we even talking today? You should sell it with those other people. You should accept their offers. I can't do this. Isn't going to work for me. Because the sooner you do this, the better. Then the seventh seller might say, oh, well, shoot. I mean, what do I need to do? I mean, I was hoping to sell this thing, I was. I've already spent the money in my head like, well, I don't know. What's the least you could take. Don't give them a number. Make them come back to you with a number. I don't know what's the least you could take. Can you do any better than that? I don't think I can make that work. Well. What's wrong? You know, and then go to the list. Doesn't have a perc test. The neighbors. You know, the access isn't as easy as we thought it was. The terrain was too slope. It hasn't been cleared. The access is not paved. The HOA fees are too expensive. There's too many other properties that haven't sold recently yet. I called a bunch of buyers. None of them are interested. The realtors say it's going to be too hard to get drill. Drill for water. The realtors said that if you know whatever this is, and you make them come back with a number.

Joe:   We have too many students right now. They're getting stupid deals under contract. They're offering way too much, and they're hoping that they can sell it. And they're going back to this spreadsheet and they're, you know, instead of selling it for 19 five, they're trying to sell it for 25,000. And they're like, I'm okay with the $5,000 wholesale. And you know what? I'm not going to pay a realtor 10%. I'm going to pay a realtor 5%. And I'd better not do oops, because I know what I'm doing and I'm going to I'm going to use my own money. And then all of a sudden they're here. They're offering 16,000. I'll still make $5,000. I'll do the discount broker list, and I'll only pay a thousand bucks to a buyer's agent. You know what? This is how you'd not make. This is how you lose money in this business. Well, at least you don't make any money. Yeah, you're losing money because you're spending all this money on marketing, but you're making stupid offers, okay? You see this? This is so important. Be more. If you have a property selling for 25 to $30,000, sell yours for 19,500 and go for the $10,000 wholesale fee. Make sure you're generous with the realtor commissions. You've got to have an oops factor in there, but at least 1000 bucks. All right, there you go. You're offering 4000, but you're not making that offer. First, the seller is making the offer first. They're saying I could sell it for nine. I'd sell it for ten. Whatever. It's probably not going to work. So if your number here is far of 4000, the seller says they'll sell it for ten. Why? Why would you say, okay, why would you, why would you? But you're Joe I if I take, if I sell, if I get another contract for ten, maybe instead of $10,000 wholesale. I'll make $5,000, you know. That's better than a poke in the eye with a stick. $5,000 won't make a huge difference in my life. No, the problem is going to be you're not going to be able to sell that deal. I want you to aim higher. Guys, I want you to shoot higher. That makes sense. And you're thinking, because I hear this. And this is what I used to think. Oh, man, I can never make $10,000 on a deal. I'd be happy just to make $3,000. Or when I used to go to a lot of the real estate clubs when I was first getting started. You hear people talking about wholesaling. It works, but it's really hard. I mean, if you're lucky, if you make $3,000 on a deal, the average wholesale fee is $3,000. I heard people say this all the time. Yeah, you know. You're in. I've been doing this business a long time. There is no buyers out there that are going to let you make $10,000 on their wholesale deals. They'll pay you 3000, maybe 5000 if you're really good. Don't listen to those late night gurus and their infomercials. I don't even do infomercials anymore. You know, it's just a scam. Nobody makes $10,000 on deals. And so you lower your standards and you start lowering. You're not going to get $10,000 if you're not asking for it. You're not going to get deals at $0.20 on the dollar if you're not asking for it. So you need to man up and start being more aggressive with your offers. You need to go for no. You need to be willing to walk away from a deal. Am I? Am I? I hope I'm making sense to you all here. This is so important.

Joe:   Okay. Well, when I was getting started, I had a I had an acquisitions manager. He was a part time pastor making eight bucks an hour, working part time at Home Depot. And I knew he was really good with people, and I wanted to bring him on as my acquisition manager. But his wife wouldn't let him quit Home Depot unless I was paying him $8 an hour. So I paid him eight bucks an hour, and then I was giving him a percentage of the profits within about, you know, three months. He's talking to sellers. He's like, sure, this is amazing. This is awesome. We can make $3,000. Like, how many hours do you have to work to make $3,000 at Home Depot? That's a lot of hours, right? He's all excited. I said, okay, but you know what? We need to shoot higher. So I couldn't get him to shoot for $10,000 minimum wholesale profits. So I said, all right, let's try to get five next time. So he would try to get five. He's like, oh my gosh it works. Like I just I was so embarrassed I would and he would talk about us. I was too afraid to ask for this price because I thought it was ridiculous and they accepted it. I said, all right, let's try to get $7,500 next time. And we did. And then let's try to get stand up. So this took about 3 or 4 months to get him finally to the place where he would be willing to ask for it or make an offer where we were making at least ten grand. And guess what? Some deals now we started expecting it. Some deals. We made ten grand, son. We made only five, some we made $15,000 in profit. But guess how many deals we were making? $10,000 in profit on when we were trying to get three? None. Guess how many deals we lost because we were trying to get a lower price? I don't know the number for that, but he was getting just as many deals under contract, being more aggressive with the asking price, with the offer amounts. Okay. And we would go back to the sellers and asking this question, if I could pay you cash close in 30 days, what's the least you would take? Oh, jeez, I don't know. You don't know? I don't think I'm interested. I don't think I'm your buyer. You're not in a hurry to sell this thing, right? What are you going to do if you can't sell this in the next 30 days, you should just rent it out. And then. I'm talking houses now. But it's the same with land. You should just. You know, we should listen to whether you should re-enlisted with an agent. Like. Like there's no way I can do that. And that's probably not going to work for me. If you want full reach, so do you. What's more important, you, Mr. Seller? Do you want to sell it as fast as possible for the highest price as possible? What's your preference? I want to help you sell this thing. I'm probably not your buyer. So what's the least you could take for it? Can you do any better than that? Well, I'm looking here. I see that, you know, there's not good road access, and the terrain is pretty steep in the area. It'd be too hard to get a building permit. The HOA restrictions are too tight. Nature. How much are they? Enjoys every month. 300 bucks. Oh, I'm not interested. It's probably not going to work. You see where I'm doing here? What's the least you could take, Mr. Seller? Ask him five times. Can you do any better than that? If it's. If you have to come up with a number. Okay. And if you don't feel the pit in your stomach uncomfortable, like, oh my gosh, this is going to really make them mad, then you're offering way too much. You're offering too much. And so if your number is 4000, don't start with 4000. So I can I could probably I don't know. This is going to make you really mad. I could probably offer somewhere in the 2 to $3000 range. I know, it's really. I'm sorry. Okay, see what they say? Oh, yeah. I can't do that. Yeah. Sometimes if they do not come up with a number. This is a trick that Gavin taught me, it's really good. If they can't come with the number because they just don't know. And you do this on the phone. Well, listen, I probably. Are you sure you want me to give you a number? Because it's probably it's going to be really low and it's going to make you mad. Yeah, yeah. Go ahead. And then you say, listen, if I were to make you an offer of like $3,000, what would you say? Oh my gosh, that's ridiculous. I'm not going to give this away. I'll just give it to my daughters. Okay, fine. Well, good thing I said good thing I didn't offer that then, right? Because I said, what if. I was going to offer this. So let me ask you. What do we need to do to get you closer to that number? So I'm being the reluctant buyer. Does that make sense? What I'm doing here. You got to do this. And, you know, some of you are just making offers, which is fine before talking to the sellers. So, you know, don't make the offer at $9,000. Make the offer at $4,000. You're going to have to make more offers before you get one accepted. That's fine. Okay. But if you can talk to sellers first before making the offers, you're going to get more of them accepted and you're going to get bigger discounts.

Joe:   But when you're making your offer, start here with this more aggressive number. I have conversations every day with land flipping students that are having a hard time selling their deals. And it's because of this. They're too optimistic. A price they can sell it for. The realtor told me I can sell it for 30 to 40. So you should be listing it for 25. Okay. That's how you sell your deals quickly. There's only two reasons why properties don't sell. It's overpriced, or you're not marketing it in front of the right buyers. I just showed you how to told you how to find the market in front of the right buyers. But now you got to get aggressive with your sales price. So I'm going to open up the chat here. I want to see what you guys think of what I'm saying. Does this resonate with you at all? And I hope it does, Mike, because this is, you know, so, so important. And, Jerry and Virginia, I'll unmute you guys here in just a minute. Okay. My struggle until now is that many sellers have accepted my offer over the phone, but it takes them a long time to sign a great gem. I'm glad you brought that up. So what do you do when a seller says yes on the phone and you send them an offer? And this is what I do. It's like, Jim, can you unmute yourself? I'm going to ask you to unmute yourself. Let's roll play a little bit. Jim. Go ahead and unmute yourself.

Jim:   Hi, Joe.

Joe:   Hey, Jim.

Jim:   Good afternoon.

Joe:   Okay. I'm going to be the investor. You're the seller. Okay, hey Jim, let's just maybe do this from the beginning. I'm going to try my best here. Hey, Jim, I got your voicemail about your property. How are you?

Jim:   Doing great here.

Joe:   Nice, nice. Listen, do you mind if I ask you some questions about your property? I don't know if I'm your buyer or not, but can I ask you some questions and see if this would be something that I'd be interested in?

Jim:   All right. No worries.

Joe:   Cool. So tell me. Tell me about what's your situation? What's going on? Why do you want to sell this thing?

Jim:   Well, just have financial difficulty since the pandemic, so, you know, it's a little bit struggle right now.

Joe:   Oh, I'm sorry to hear that. What's going on?

Jim:   Yeah, I just I have no choice to sell this property, but I really need, you know, reasonable amount for this.

Joe:   Okay, so what's more important to you, Jim? To sell it quickly or to get the highest price possible?

Jim:   Well, I need a reasonable, reasonable amount for it, since I need, you know, some amount for it since, you know, I invested a lot for this property.

Joe:   All right, so what is a reasonable amount for you?

Jim:   There's a range of, like, 80 to 100,000.

Joe:   Okay. 80 to 100,000. You're not in a hurry, though, to sell the sale, right?

Jim:   No, I'm not so sure. I have to double check that with my out with my buyers in regards to this.

Joe:   Yeah, well, let me let me ask you some other questions. And this is, this is a five acre property, right? Yep. Okay. Let me look it up right now on Google Maps here. Yeah, it looks like a nice property. Okay, but. Oh. What is this year round? Is this a this is this is this a railroad track near that area there?

Jim:   Yeah. That's right.

Joe:   What's the. Okay. That's not good. What, is isn't this a dirt road, or is this this road paved?

Jim:   Oh, you know, if I'm not 100% sure about it, I have to tell my wife about it. What is, in that particular area? Joe, I apologize to no.

Joe:   Oh, I see, no know.

Jim:   Yeah.

Joe:   It looks like in the satellite view it's dirt road. Oh. By. Is it. It's not in an HOA is it.

Jim:   Yeah. It's not under HOA.

Joe:   Oh it's not. Okay. Good. All right. And so there's not off road play I'm also going to go and do a negative right. So back in so there's, there's not an HOA to take care of the road or the neighborhood community.

Jim:   Yeah. That's right.

Joe:   Shoot. Okay. Well, I'm looking here at the 3D of the map. It looks pretty sloped. Is what? Percent of the property is flat. Can I actually build on it? Do you know?

Jim:   Well, according to my wife, I like, 50% on it.

Joe:   All right, so I can about 20% of it is usable.

Jim:   Yeah. Yeah. That's right.

Joe:   Oh, boy. All right. Well, yeah. I don't know if this is this is a property for me, but, you know, let me let me look at it here. So I see there are some similar properties that are for sale in the area for, like, if I zoom out. Okay, there's some similar properties. What did you say you wanted for yours again?

Jim:   Oh, okay. Maybe a large office. I'll have to double check that with my wife.

Joe:   I see similar properties here that have sold recently and that are currently listed for like 50,000. Right? Is that right?

Jim:   Oh, I apologize, Joe. I'm not, sometimes using internet fire. Is that a internet thing?

Joe:   No, I there's some other properties I'm looking at for sale in your area for a lot less. Why is that?

Jim:   Oh, I'm not so sure about that. My apologies.

Joe:   Okay, you know what? What do you think would be a fair price in this crazy market right now for your property?

Jim:   Well, I like what I mentioned, 80 to 100,000. So you made an offer for mine?

Joe:   I'm sure your property is great, but why would I want to pay you 80 when I can buy this other property over here from 50 right now?

Jim:   Oh, well, I have to double check the records with my wife's, though.

Joe:   Okay? Yeah. You know, you should probably just listed with a realtor, don't you think?

Jim:   Well you know I really hate the process. It really took a long time for me to list it with a realtor. Yeah, I really want to make it fast as soon as possible, but I have to really check with my wife. How soon are we going to? Do you sell this property, then?

Joe:   Well, maybe we could talk with your wife together about this. Because I want to help you guys sell this property. Sounds to me like you really want to sell it quick. You want to schedule a time? We can talk with you and your wife together.

Jim:   Okay. No worries. Okay, we can do that.

Joe:   Let me off role play here. Let me. I still want to continue this, but normally I yeah, I would let's schedule a call with you and your wife as you keep on referring her. And she's. She makes decisions with you. That's good. All right, let's get let's go back to the role play. I want to ask something like, but, you know, Jim, I tell most people that, you know, if you want full price, you should listen with the realtor. I'm not a retail buyer, but I'm. I'm more of, like, the easy button. Does that make sense? So if you want to sell it quickly for cash oh Jim you muted yourself. Go and unmute yourself Jim.

Jim:  I'm sorry.

Joe:   All right. So if you want to sell it for cash and close in 30 days I'm your guy. So what what's more important to you. Do you want to sell it for the highest price possible? Listed with an agent? Or do you want to sell it in 30 days for cash?

Jim:   Well, yeah, fast cash will do.

Joe:   Okay, so if I could pay you cash and close in 30 days, what's the absolute least you would take?

Jim:   Oh, I like what I mentioned. 80 to 100,000. But, since you mentioned it now.

Joe:   Yeah, I don't think.

Jim:   It's probably with the area, but, I guess I could, I could accept, like a 60.

Joe:   Okay. What 60? Say that again. Is that right?

Jim:   Yeah. 60.

Joe:   60. All right, so if I gave you a contract today, Jim, for 60 grand, would you sign it today?

Jim:   Yes. Of course.

Joe:   Okay. You sure?

Jim:   Yep. I’ll go ahead and sign the contract now.

Joe:   Okay, good. All right, so now, off role play. I could ask for a deeper discount, couldn't I. I could go back again. Let's do that. Jim 60. I don't know if that's going to work, man. I'm looking here. I see some other properties that have sold for cheaper than that.

Jim:   Oh, all right, I understand that. But, you know, in regards to the closing cost, maybe we could split it into two.

Joe:   Okay, so can you do any better?

Jim:   Sorry. Oh, I have to, you know, like when I mention we have to I have to concern it with my lifestyle in regards to that, that the best thing that I can say is, we could split, the closing costs into two. You know, I really need my money right now. Having a financial difficulties because of the pandemic. My apologies.

Joe:   Yeah, well, yeah, I don't know if it's going to work now that, let's say boffo. Let's say that 60 grand is a great price, and I like that. Okay, I like that. All right, Jim, so I'm going to send you an offer right now for 60K. But I want to make sure like this is a good number for you. Like, do you have, like, any hesitations or any reasons why you wouldn't sign this agreement today if I sent it to you? Is your wife need to review it and approve it to the. She need to approve it with you?

Jim:   Yeah. I need to confirm it with my wife first but most likely. I believe that she will agree.

Joe:   We'll let you know before I send you the contract. Maybe we should talk with you and your wife together. Do we? Do we have some time later today? Like, maybe what time we be? Good. We can talk later today with you and your wife.

Jim:   Oh, yeah. 3 p.m. is good.

Joe:   3 p.m. Right. So let's talk at 3 p.m., okay?

Jim:   Okay.

Joe:   Let's say your wife's not a part of this, you know? And so you're just. You say yes to my offer over the phone, okay. All right. Jim, so I'm going to send you an offer right now for 60. Okay. I think I can make that work. Well, I'm going to have a little small period of due diligence, but let me ask you something. If I send you the contract right now, when can I get it back?

Jim:   Well, most likely tomorrow.

Joe:   Okay. What time tomorrow?

Jim:   Well, I like 5 p.m..

Joe:   Okay. And, do you do you know what digital signatures are? Have you ever done, like, digital signatures, like hello sign or DocuSign or something like that?

Jim:   Oh, I'm familiar with that. DocuSign.

Joe:   Okay, so what if I. I'll email it to you. Let's schedule a time to talk tomorrow at 5 p.m., and I'll walk you through how to sign it electronically over the phone. Would that work?

Jim:   Yeah. That's great.

Joe:   Okay, so I have a zoom thing here. I'm going to send you a zoom link and let's just sign it electronically over the phone. That way we can just get it done. And I can answer any questions that you have.

Jim:   That's awesome. Thank you so much, Joe.

Joe:   Ok, Jim. All right off role play. Now the question was like he's getting sellers on the phone. That's a yes on the offer that takes him to lunch. You want to give them deadlines and you want to give permissions to the seller to say no, like I and I didn't use this, but I can say, listen, I want to make you an offer and it's totally okay to say no, Mr. Seller. In fact, I want you to say no if this isn't going to work for you at all. Right?

Jim:   I understand.

Joe:   Yeah. So yeah. So that is going to be helpful for you. It takes the pressure off of Oh we lost Jim I know. There he goes. All right. It takes the pressure off you and the seller when you say, listen, it's okay if you say no. And if they say, I need to think about it sometimes I'll say usually, Mr. Southern, when people tell me they need to think about it, it's just because they're not interested in an offer. Right. And that's okay. So that's why I want to firm commitment. If I send you the offer, can you get it back to me today? Now, another thing to if it's an older person maybe, and they don't know how to do digital signature, they wouldn't know how to get on zoom like we are now or whatever. I might send a mobile notary to their house if you just go to this Google mobile notary or 123 notary.com, I think it is. You can for 100 bucks, sometimes less. You can hire a mobile notary to go to their house and get the document signed. It doesn't have to be notarized, but they can just sign it that way. That's another deadline or commitment that that notary is going to go there at 3:00 tomorrow to get something signed. That makes sense. That's important. When you're sending offers, don't send an offer. Sometimes sellers will say, just send me an offer to get you off the phone because they don't know how to say no. They don't feel comfortable saying no. Remember, read that book. Go for no. Give them permission to say no. It's the end. You just say, listen, I understand where you are with this and you need to think about it. That's fine. I'll send you an offer when you're ready to sign it. So why don't you think about it and then get back to me when you're ready to sell? I'm not going to send them an offer without a commitment to sign it. Send it back to me by a deadline. With a deadline. That makes sense. All right, now, having said that, I'm still going to send them an offer on the and in the mail anyway, and I'm going to send that offer every 30 days. So I'm still sending an offer, but can I send an offer to every seller? That's the whole point of this challenge. We're sending offers to every sellers in the mail because nobody else does that. And we're following up, which nobody else does with following up with these sellers. Okay. Let's, let's unmute Jerry there.

Jerry:   Thank you. This has been, phenomenal stuff. And I really appreciate all the information and, and guidance you've given us. Just had a quick question. If the property, the property is already on the MLS. And then it sounds like from what you were telling us, the best starting point would be then to go to the investors in the area. Could you what would kind of walk us through that process? This I know you did on the last training. Just real quickly walk us through that process of finding those investors. But then what are some other ways that we could, you know, go off market to try and find people? What would what would be your suggestions and the best ways to go off?

Joe:   Yeah. Well, first of all, so remember, when you're to go on to properties that are on the MLS, you need to relist that property for way cheaper than what their current prices. Yeah. Makes sense. So if they're listing it for 30 and it hasn't sold it for in six months, you're going to need to sell it for 20 or something. Which means you're going to need to offer like $5,000. So it's it does happen. But to get that seller to jump from, drop from 30 to $5000, it's a long shot. But it does happen. But the point of dealing when you're talking to realtors is to build a relationship. Follow up every 30 days and ask them, do you have any other deals? Do you have any other off market properties? Okay, so you still make the offer for five grand. It's going to make the seller really mad. You give them the warning in advance. You know, who knows. One out of 500, one out of 200, one out of 1000 will accept it. I've seen it happen many times. They're just sick of it. They're done with it. I don't care anymore. Fine. Okay. Now, how do you find the buyers for those properties? I'll run to this real quick because this is important. And, I do cover this in the class. My lease option. My my land for class. Right. First thing I want to do well in Freedom Soft. You can go to tools lead finder. Now there's land and you can do buyer leads land. Okay. You go to next, you can choose your county. I was just in Muskegon County. Let's now what is up? Look up. There it is. Muskegon. All right. Next active buyers. Now I'm going to do right here advanced search. So I want absentee owners. And I only want out of zip code owners. I want owners that are out of that zip code that are buying land. Their ownership type doesn't matter. Okay. I want the last sale date to be six months 123456. So since December 1st and I'm going to uncheck include I know that it has to be no. All right land type I'm going to do all land filters. Let's say my property is, you know, five acres. Whatever I'm going to do half acre to ten acres let's say. All right. So these are absentee owners. They're out of the zip code. So they're not like in that zip code already. So so then I click search and I got 33 buyers here. Then it's remove duplicates. So that doesn't mean there's 33 transactions. This is just there's 33 different buyers that have bought them out of that state. All right. We're out of that zip code. And you can download this list added to a lead list. You can skip trace them, call them, send them a letter said are now in my O. This is my client's account here. I should still have it in here. There's a I think let me check here in the direct mail templates are here is a desperate motivated land buyer yellow letter. And sometimes I'll send this letter to all of them. I desperately need to sell my vacant lot close to the one you own near city. I've had it on the market for some time now. I can't wait any longer. If you're looking to buy more land in the area, call me. I'll tell you all about it. I need it sold today. Call me. Please make me cash offer right now. Phone number. Okay. And you can send that letter. It's not going to be crumpled up. You can send that letter to everybody. Okay. You can also create a postcard and. Yeah. So I don't have that in here. But there is that you can turn that into a postcard. All right. That's one thing. There's another tool that I like to use and it's not cheap. It's get investor base.com I get an affiliate commission from this but I get investor base.com. It's $197 a month. So it's not cheap. But if you click here it will give you and that area on that property all the landlords and flippers. Now a landlord is a buy and hold investor and a flipper is somebody that bought it and then resold it. And it can do houses and land. And what it does here is it gives you who these buyers are. This is a flipper who bought this property for 105 months, later, sold it for $203,000. This is their phone number. And this is the mailing address. Here's a landlord that owns 16 properties and this is their address. These are the phone numbers. And so this is a great way. Now you know get investor base isn't cheap. It's 197 a month. But it's amazing if you're so I have some clients right now guys who, are networking with other investors like us in different land Facebook groups and telling them, hey, I will help you find buyers, let's partner JV on deals and they get tools like investor base. They do this marketing and freedom soft and they find the buyers and they just call them mail them. So some sometimes you get deals under contract. They're good deals. They're good deals. But you don't have the time to find do any aggressive marketing. You can find somebody else that can do this stuff for you, ups that can do this stuff for you. And you can contact all these buyers here. And this is an amazing tool. The cool thing about investor base is the skip tracing is included. And it. Gives you the addresses of the flippers. So Freedom Soft doesn't even do this because it's only showing you who owns the property now. You know, it's hard to find the person who bought it a year ago, sold it six months later, and it's not on property records anymore. Does that make sense? All right. So anyway, that's one thing I like to do. The other thing is I just go to Land.com and whatever. Let's say you've got a property six, three, two, three or whatever I'm going to look for. Let me zoom out a little bit. I'm going to look for who are the investors and the realtors that are paying for sponsored listings here in this area. All right. So this guy Justin Beck, I see him around a lot. He's a land investor. There's his phone number. He's out of he's out of Colorado. And this is a property in Arizona. So I'm gonna call him and say, hey, I got a deal here. Do you want to partner on it? He's already got buyers. This guy Joseph GMC, JMC land this. It's like an investor. So call him. And so find the other investors that are selling land in this area and call them like you can go here and in your filters. You could even do a search for Solds. Let's just look for Solds Austin got from land freedom Abbey a lot of land. We've got land compass land, USA land addiction. You think that's an investor, right? So call them. They you know, they might have buyers, they can partner with you on the deal. They can split it. So after you and then one more till you go to Redfin and you call realtors. I don't know where this property was. I was looking at it last year. I was looking for land here in this area. Let's go to come on nearby homes for sale. Now let's go to Solds. The last year done on type land. So now I'm going to start zooming out to zoom out a lot. Now there's 28 properties here that have sold vacant land in the last year. So I'm just going to start going through this and calling the realtors. It'll tell you the listing agent and the buyer's agent and start calling them and say, hey, I got another property. So you do all of this, you call other investors, we're advertising land there. You call other realtors, you call investors, send letters, and you should be able to do all of that within a week. Start talking to people. You send out those letters right away. Maybe that takes two weeks to get responses and you'll find out if you've got a good deal or not. And if you're not getting much interest, nobody's calling you. Nobody's returning your calls or whatever. Like, you may not have a good deal, and you want to make sure again, when you're looking at actives on the MLS, your property is the cheapest. It's got to be their cheapest property, either by acre or, you know, you got to be cheaper than the bigger properties. You want to price yours aggressively and you'll find out real quick if it's a good deal or not. And if it's not, go back to the seller right away and we either cancel the contract or negotiate a lower price. We've got time for one more question. How about Virginia?

Virginia:  Hi, Joe. This is, just a quick question. I've been doing the seven offers a week. This week, I'm kind of switching my marketing to doing two blasting, blind offers to real estate agents. In the beginning, you had said, if I do that, like 30 a day, that I workout. Well, I still count if I do 30 a day. Oh, I like to own ten for the week or not. If not, it's okay. I'll still do the calls, but they would only be for doing this, for this challenge.

Joe:   You know, I mean, 30 a day is a lot. That's awesome. So that's fine. It'll count.

Virginia:  Oh, that's no problem.

Joe:   The rules were these got to be offers from people that raised their hand and said, yeah, I want an offer. Right. Somebody talked to somebody that responded to your mail. Right. That's a different quality to the quality of a just blind offer that you blast out is very low.

Virginia:  These are real estate agents. So they're all listed properties. So at least they're listed properties.

Joe:   I would still suggest talking to them. You got to call them because you're going to get you're going to get a deal faster that way.

Virginia:  Okay. Well I can call them, but I'm doing this anyway. So it's a good, you know, for me, easier if I could just use that.

Joe:   All right. But I try to talk to them because they're going to have other deals. Right. Yeah. They're going to have other properties that they're going to tell you about.

Virginia:  Okay. Yeah, I can call that because a lot of agents are responding. They're responding negatively. But I could call them and just say, hey, do you have anything else? So I put an offer in on. So then put an offer on that.

Joe:   I paid 10% commissions on any deals you bring me. I'm looking for cheap, off market properties that you don't want to list. Listen, these realtors are listing cheap properties. They don't like what they're doing. They don't want to list things. They would rather just call you next time. And. And you make an offer. They get 10% commissions. So that's why we're calling these realtors establishing a relationship to follow up every 30 days. Hey I'm looking for deals. Do you have any off market land deals. You start getting a database 50, 100, 200 of these realtors and you're emailing them, texting them, calling them every 30 days. Do you have any deals? I'm looking for properties. They're going to start sending them to you. And that's the whole point of that. So good.

Virginia:  So you still want me to make the seven offers a week?

Joe:   It's up to you, Virginia. Like, I want you to make offers. So. Yeah, if you send if you send 30 offers a day, that is.

Virginia:  210.

Joe:   210 a week, and you do that for four weeks, that's 840 offers. Sure. I'll refund you the offer challenge, although that's not what we said we would do. And it's only for you. So anybody else listening to this? It's not for you.

Virginia:  Well so far. I've done the seven offers for the three weeks, so it would only be for this week. Putting in offers for this week.

Joe:   Okay. That's good.

Virginia:  Okay.

Joe:   I'm gonna wrap this up. Thanks, Virginia. All right. I appreciate you all. I hope this was helpful to you guys, because I have not even had time to look at all the chat. Let me just look real quick. Just freedom sort to have a way to automate follow up with realtors every 30 days. Yeah. So you can send an email is probably the best way to do it. Every 30 days you can do it in the workflow automation, in workflow automations, you can have it send an email every 30 days. You can also do texting, but texting doesn't work as well. It does work, but if you start sending too many freedom, software will start locking you down because the carriers will lock that number of spam. So you just got to be careful of that. Well, also, I would suggest you could look at maybe doing a small amount of voicemails. You can't do that in freedom, but you could do one at a time with something like slide dial. Where you could potentially just one at a time. Hey, Jim, this is Jerry just following up. We talked a while ago. I know you don't remember me. Just looking for any vacant land deals. Off market. Vacant land deals. Do you have any? Let me know. Thanks. So it's personalized. You're calling them by name, leaving them a voicemail? You could do something like that. Yeah. Dorothy, I'm offering too much. I need to be more aggressive. Yes. I've had sellers say yes and don't send back the signed documents. Yeah, because sometimes sellers will just say yes to get you off the phone. They don't want to say no. Now, again, I'll still send the offer as I send everybody off, but I'm not expecting to get it back unless I get a firm date commitment from them. And if you got to find out why they're not willing to say yes. It could be they want to talk to their wife. It could be they're just busy right now. And they're going to say, send me something and I'll think about it. Okay. Like you need to know why. And that's why you got to read that book. Go for. No. So you can understand. You got to get a no, don't get a maybe I need to think about it. Not good enough. I need to think about it. Maybe equals. No. Just fine. Get a no from the seller. Still send them an offer. Follow up every 30 days. That's the secret to all this. Okay, guys, we got to wrap it up. We'll see you later. Adios. Yeah. Ringless voicemail is illegal in Virginia, but you can do little one offs. Okay? Just a one off is fine. My opinion? I'm not a lawyer, but if it's personal. Hey, Jim, this is Virginia calling a follow up, blah blah, blah. And you're doing that one off at a time. It's personalized. That's not a problem. I mean, maybe it is, but don't quote me on that. I'm not a lawyer. It is. It is illegal. So don't do it. All right, see you guys. Bye bye.

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