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We're talking about cash flow with my special guest, the one and only Antonio Edwards. I've known Antonio for a long time, and he's a very active investor and influencer. Here, he shares his story and how he got started in real estate. Antonio has done it all. He's done all kinds of deals, from fix and flip, to rehabs to wholesaling to creative financing. He's a veteran in the business, and we talk about some old war stories and all about what’s working today in this market.

I have a special workshop that I do every Saturday called the Land Fast Start Masterclass. I basically start with the premise. If I had to start all over again from scratch and go into a brand new market, what would I do? In this workshop, we’re going to pull a list of buyers and sellers, do a marketing campaign, and make offers. It's a full, comprehensive A to Z class on how to start a brand new land flipping business. Head to Joemccall.com/saturday. It's just seven bucks.

Listen and learn:

What’s inside:

  • All about Antonio’s real estate business journey
  • Antonio’s process for finding leads and doing deals
  • Info on Antonio’s Cash Flow Innovator tool

Mentioned in this episode:

Download episode transcript in PDF format here…

Joe:   What's up guys? Joe McCall here from the Real Estate Investing Mastery podcast. And I got a special guest today. We're going to be talking about cash flow with the one and only Antonio Edwards. I've known Antonio for a long time. I've probably known him longer than he's known me. But he's a very active investor and influencer, and we're going to hear about his story, how he got started into real estate and why I'm still I we were talking about this. I wanted to find out why were you moving to California during the start of the pandemic, when everybody was leaving California from Florida. So we're going to talk about that with Antonio. But he's also done some really cool things. And we're going to be talking about cash flow, why cash flow is so important for wholesalers and investors today. And Antonio has done it all. He's done all kinds of deals from fix and flip, from rehabs to wholesaling to creative financing. He's done it all. He's been he's a veteran in the business, been doing this a long, long time. And so I just appreciate having him come. And we're going to be talking some old war stories probably, and talking about what he is seeing that's working today in this market, even though he still lives in California. For what? And I can say all this because I'm from Southern California, but so I'm going to give him a hard time, find out why on earth he's still there. But it's going to be a great show. First, I want to tell you, though, I have a special workshop that I do every Saturday, called the Land Fast Start Masterclass. And if you go to Joe mccall.com/saturday right here, you will find this special class that I do. It's just $7. And I basically start with the premise. If I had to start all over again from scratch and go into a brand new market, what would I do? So in this workshop, you're going to see me pick a market with you. We're going to go in and we're going to pull a list, see what the hot markets are, where the buyers are. We're going to pull a list of buyers and sellers. We're going to start a marketing campaign of cold calling and direct mail, and then we're actually going to start making offers. It's a full, comprehensive A to Z class on how to start a brand new land flipping business. Just go to Joe mccall.com/saturday. It's just seven bucks. Cool. All right. Let's bring Antonio on Antonio Edwards. How are you man?

Antonio:  I'm good, Joe thanks for having me on the podcast, man. Like, say we known each other for so long.

Joe:   I don't know why we've not done a podcast before, but. Glad you're here. Yeah. Let's start with why you got started in real estate. And how long ago was that?

Antonio:   Well, I guess I'm gonna go back to a year where people probably won't be able to guess my age.

Joe:   I'm. No, I'm gonna guess your early 30s.

Antonio:  Early 30s? Wow. I appreciate the kindness, Joe, but your numbers, ARV is off man.

Joe:   All right, I got it.

Antonio:  I turned 41 two weeks ago, actually the 27th. So we was in a mastermind one of the days when our mastermind I turned 41.

Joe:   That's right. Good for you. Happy birthday.

Antonio:  Yeah, thank you man. So I came into real estate game in 2009. We all know that time, you and I at least. Right? Great recession, the world was on sale, my ears was green. Didn't know much of our real estate. I didn't even know it was a crash. Joe, I just I came in a newbie, very optimistic at the time because I had a I had a mentor named Chris Haskins. Shout out to Chris Haskins in my Virginia market.

Joe:   I like Chris.

Antonio: Great guy. He was five years in in 2009. So he was very versed, very experienced in the single family world. And he was like, you know what, Antonio? You like, you reminded myself, I come from the music business, Joe. So. And he was running me as a business. So that's how we a lot connected was like for music. He's like, man, like, that's one of the hardest business to be in, man. It's like, how would you like to learn his real estate thing? And I'm like, I don't have credit. I don't have a lot of money. I can't, that's not me. I was this my learning to believe at the time. I was like, man, what you say you don't need credit, you need money like this. This thing called wholesaling. I'm like, I heard a wholesaler from Rich dad, poor dad. But I still thought you need a lot of money. Not a lot of credit. So being. And I had him, like, just a call away. It made it that much possible for me to get into it. So he actually took me under his wing. He was like, how about this? How much money do you have? I say, I got a couple hundred dollars, but I do have a credit card. Was, you know, thousand dollars on or whatever the case may be, is I want to order some bad designs, so I order a hardware band. This is Joe. And this was back when bandit signs. You could put out 6200 a banner sign to get a deal. That's back when you can get motivated sales from bandit signs. Now is a different time, but I ordered a hundred bandit signs, a hundred stakes and put them out and all in one night by myself.

Joe:   And what market.

Antonio:  This was in Virginia market. Okay. Virginia beach, Norfolk. Hampton market. So I put out 100 bandit signs by myself in a matter like 4 to 5 hours, right from, like, midnight and like four ish in the morning. Right? I just was pumped up. I was like, I got this guy who I can call a reach away. He's five years in. He's relatable. He's doing deals. I seen his deals. I was like, if he can do it, I can do it. Next thing I know I'll say about a week a week to two weeks pass right out the banner signs, I get this one call I was. Getting close, but I get this one call. It was, it was. It was a crack at house for brothers, though. Dope. And one sober brother. Wright, the one sober brother, had a power of attorney to sell this house in Chesapeake, Virginia. 721 Potter Road, Chesapeake, Virginia. Never forget that house. Right. And so as soon as we get this call, I came on my cell phone. I had my cell phone. This business has had no structure, no systems. I just got I just got crews disguises. Get started man. I'm like, oh, okay, just put all these signs up. So I'm getting these calls on my on my cell phone. Anyway, this this guy call the one sober brother that was selling the, the house in San Antonio Potter Road. His brothers brother's in the house. He was motivated. He had his whole family going on his own house. But his brothers, his four brothers was live in his 721 patrol. Four brothers cracked out in the neighbors was just everybody. They were just complaining. Police was getting called a couple times out the mug because the these brothers were just there was call a cause, a ruckus, a neighborhood. So we go out there at the property and I just man, I remember like yesterday and not just my mindset at the time, I'm like, who the hell will want to buy this? Like, it was no power. Now it was shit in the toilet. It was leaky. The ceiling was leaking in certain parts of the house and it smelled. It just smelled. I smell like shit. And I remember I was, I talking, I was like, all about. It's like that never reached in my brain that people were bodies, houses. Neat. I remember like yesterday, he was like, smells like money in here. He's like, I was like, money.

Joe:   Yeah.

Antonio:  And to make a long story short where we're in the backyard with the sober air. Right. The sober brother, the four brothers, like one. I remember one was just laid out the couch. He was just like this. Like he was drugged out, had liquor bottles on the like on the table. It was. It was a bad situation, man. So we're in the backyard on this tree. Start with the sober brother that met us there, and we lock up this property in the backyard for $48,000, right? I'm actually, like, taking notes internally because Chris is actually the one talking to the brother. He's the cocaine. And I believe the brother wanted maybe like 660 ish K 65 K, right. And I remember before we walk on a tree start, Chris walks in that this was an early no that it took off. And I still use this this cause to distilled this trick to my day. Chris walked up to the worst part of the property outside. Well, that the unit was broken and he was like, how much do you want this property in? As he looked at the unit and it was like, 65 K but and he's like, well, how long has this unit been broken?

Joe:   Do you mean the air conditioning unit?

Antonio:  Air conditioning unit outside. And he just the worst part outside of the house, and as we're saying, is like, you hear the brothers and roll, you know, they're like. And it was like, how long your brother's been living here? Like, it was just he was just internally, like, divining the value of what the owner was asking. Right. The sober brother. Yeah. And like, next thing I know, we got him down to 48 K from like six, say 65. We go to tree stump, we lock it up the property. A two page agreement. Simple. At the time it just looked at like Chinese but is is very simple to pray. Two page assignment purchase agreement I mean assignable purchase agreement 48,000. We leave that. We leave the property in Chris's truck because I work with them. Yeah. We buy houses wrapped truck and he call as we're driving. He calls a buyer for 60,500 on our speaker. And I just remember 2 to 3 hours later, he didn't even getting on our side of property. I think it just drove by it. Right? He just took it. This. I'll buy. I'll buy it.

Joe:   Now. This was then. This was in 2009.

Antonio:  This is in 2009. The great, the Great Recession from a hundred bandit signs. This was supposed to be a three way closing, but it does probably end up taking a couple months due to, title issues. There was child support judges from one of the criteria was couple things I had to clear up, but this probably took about 2 to 3 months to close what I want to say three weeks, but I made 12,500 on my first deal.

Joe:   That's amazing. One of the things I should note, people, you got to put yourself back in that day, 2009. I should say this to rewind itself a little bit to, yeah, there are some guys out there in social media right now who think they invented wholesaling. They think that, they coached everybody who's doing wholesaling now today. And they didn't even get started in the business till like 2012, 2013, 2014. And they think they're the OGs. Well, whatever. Right. Like but here's the thing I want you all to understand, wholesaling started like with I'm looking at a book over here by Carlton. No. Robert Allen, Robert Allen, it's called Nothing Down. And it says on their revised for the 80s.

Antonio:  Wow.

Joe:   Revised for the 80s and this stuff has been around for a long, long time there. Antonio, I know you have coached a lot of the people who have been coaching other people who are now coaching other people. And so but there are still people before us that were doing this business. And so here's my whole point. I started studying real estate in about 2006, and wholesaling was really big back then in 2000. And so when the market crashed in oh nine, there was a lot of people that quit wholesaling. A lot of people stopped doing it because they thought the market is falling apart. No. And I remember thinking and hearing this from people. There were no buyers. Nobody wanted to buy real estate anymore. But good thing you had a mentor, Chris, who didn't care what people thought. Right. And good thing you didn't know any better either, because of even when the market was at its lowest and it was free falling, you still had buyers that wanted real estate and you still had motivated sellers. You still had buyers, right?

Antonio:  Well, the sellers were motivated sellers everywhere back, back in that time. Yeah. I mean, you can just this if you're watching this video, if you're new and haven't done and deal. We've done a few deals right now. If you if you were 2009, you're probably up to 20 or 30 views because it was just having very little competition. Now I was a new wholesaler, coming into the game and a great recession. But there I will go to these REIA meetings with Chris, and you have new vinyl that's just coming in. So you had the new wholesalers. It was very little flippers, but you had these new buy and hold investors. So I was flipping to the buy and hold investors mostly. Right. And we all didn't know anybody. Like you said, I didn't know any better. And they really didn't know any better. Or if they did, they were very sophisticated and they sold to assets before the crash. And it was waiting for this time to buy these properties very cheap, which I look at. Some of my properties are also back then Joe, and I'm like, well, like I had a problem contract for five K and I slowed it for fifth day amid a ten K a summer fee. But it's like, why did I keep that? You know, that was just my mindset. I was looking for the quick flip, quick flip. And I could have kept. So because I was flipping out, I was forcing a lot of properties back, a lot of properties. Yeah, mostly from an MLS side of MLS was my go to.

Joe:   Yeah. You know the market is constantly shifting back then I remember when I was learning wholesaling from people that were teaching it in Phoenix, Arizona, the joke was in Phoenix, you couldn't walk down the street and not trip over bandit signs. They were everywhere. And so people were complaining back then about the competition. And I remember it. And I see this happen all the time. People are either complaining. Most people. Not everybody. Everybody. The only people that are complaining, by the way, arethe people not doing deals, right. The people that are doing deals, they're just hustling their heads down. And they're working there grinding and they're doing deals and they're making money. But everybody who is not even trying it, they're the commissioners. But like back then, people were complaining all their sellers everywhere, but no buyers. There are no buyers that will buy these deals. And that just wasn't true. That just wasn't true today. And then today there's people complaining that's either one or the other. You know, there's no motivated sellers or there's no deals out there, or there's too many hedge funds or whatever. So people will always find something to complain about. So that's just kind of history just keeps on repeating itself. And there is always opportunity there. Wealth doesn't disappear, it just transfers. So what may have worked a year ago doesn't work today, but it'll probably work again later. The cheese just keeps on moving. And so it's important to be as well-educated as you can. I guess one of the things I'm trying to say you have you seen that same kind of thing happen?

Antonio:  Absolutely. My state of mindset, I think would probably like 2012 era. I was like, man, these deals are going to run out. And like, the deals never run out. Is it possible for deals to run out? I flip one property 4 or 5 times over my the same house. It comes back to you maybe from a, motivated, another motivated seller for a row. It comes back in different forms. So the deals are endless for people. That's why the deals are endless. And now that maybe the marketing strategies may, pivot and shift and change, but a lot of times now, I'm seeing the market, the, the market strategies recycle. So I one point I, I'm like cold calling was number one. Like to me I don't think cold calls number one I think people and direct mail are top the top tiers for generating leads. You know where that's not new under the sun. You know, back in the great snow ten years ago, direct mail was kill it. But now, to me, direct mail is back. Like this, this recycle it all over and over again. So with people, I think people's always done like, under the table, like a, like a low key, great marketing strategy. But now a lot of people are using PPL, which is a great way to get leads.

Joe:   PPL is pay per lead. It's like Google Facebook ads. Yeah. Pay per lead. You don't have to run the ads. You pay somebody else to do that for you and you get the leads. Right?

Antonio:  Yeah, great way to get leads. Yeah. It's not the cheapest but is a great way.

Joe:   Right. All right. So you started wholesaling in 2009. Were you able to, to build a big business pretty quickly?

Antonio:  Yeah. My well, it depends on who's watching this, but I thought this was a lot of money. My first six months, I had $100,000 liquid in my account. Where I come from. Joe, I thought I had 100,000,100. So just straight wholesaling, man. Well, my second deal was a rehab, and I learned a lot in that rehab telling me, five k on. But along the other deals were all wholesale deals. And I looked up and like, like you said earlier, like, you know, your hairstyling and you just grind and you and you, you know, not worry about anybody else. I looked up my bank and I had 105,000 in my account, $105,000 in my account. And I was like, yeah, let me keep going. So then I read the book, at the time, Timothy Ferriss Four Hour Workweek. And I started learning his outsourcing methods and delegating and hiring Vas and, you know, so now I'm starting to form structures and systems where, you know, at the time was, 24 hour answering service. I was use a lives. And I had, Howard two vas and I remember one of freedom softwares was the big CRM. They had their first launch and I got the Freedom Soft in March, and I paid three K for that. I was I was still in good man. I had a CRM, I had a pet, a pet live and for service 24 seven. I had two VAs that were taken on my managing my lease up front. I was always disappointed. At the time I didn't hire or disappointed like later, but I started to feel good about myself because I like now. Like I'm not just this is not a hobby. I'm starting creating a business and infrastructure. And looking at and next, next thing I look up, I had I think the most that I had on a contract were like 18 deals, 18 properties, bandit signs and MLS. That was my two because at that time, Joe, you can like literally you can go look at a problem, just say $100,000 is listed for $100,000. I lock it up for $100,000, and I sell it to Joe McCall investments for a half of 15,000. You did not care that it was listed for a hundred thousand because it was still a great deal. It was still a great deal. It was not many investors. We got to figure there was a time where it wasn't that it wasn't a competition. It was very, very little competition. It was too many deals for investors. So it was it was something that's so much immature on a market where you. I sell it to you 15,000. I was more than what it was listing MLS, but it still fits your buy box.

Joe:   Well, at the time, the important thing was finding the buyers. Yes. And. Right. So you were you focus on a lot of marketing for buyers.

Antonio:  Well, no. No, I was focusin marketing. I was not focused on finding a deals because a lot of my, a lot of my buyers were coming from these REIA meetings. I was going to rare meetings. And actually, I actually got awarded for a rookie of the year my first year at the local Virginia Beach REIA. They, I still have that, plaque today, work at a year.

Joe:   That's cool.

Antonio:  Wasn't even a spec. And I'm just sitting there in meet. I'm in the back, and it was getting these, awards out, and that wasn't in my register. Joe, would they call my name for rookie of the year? Because I was I was, man, I was I was really hustling, man. I was really I was flip into buyers. Were these buyers were like, who's this Antonio kid? Like, damn, he's sent me three deals in a month. Like, how's he get these days? Hosts fantasize and MLS right. That was my two acquisitions. Lead generation sources back then. But like, yeah, I mean, times has changed. Now we're at 2024. Time for today's video. Joe said different breed. Right now I'm a different breed.

Joe:   It is. A lot has changed. So what are you doing now?

Antonio:  Mainly right now I'm focusing on cash flow, man. Really, what I've learned flipping houses over the years is that Uncle Sam's going to get half his cut. Yeah, he's going to get half of that plate. He's going to get half of that.

Joe:   Half of it.

Antonio:  Easily half. So, I want like I want, I want to say 2011 like, $2,010. 11. Like, I really wasn't ready for what my tax like what I had to pay in taxes. So I was making is I got to figure my first six months of real estate. I had 105,000. I was liquid, but I was doing marketing and whatnot. But I was also spending like a low lifestyle at the time. I felt good about myself, you know, I was doing low travels and whatnot. I'm no single dad. I, I might have my one son at the time, he's, he's 22 now, about to be 23, but it freaking punched me in the face that 2010 and then 2011 taxes really pushed my feet. So that was an entire year of flipping houses, not holding any of those houses like Pac Man. Like I didn't learn this pocket part of the game. I got I got to figure this out. It has to be a way to this. It has to be a way. So I, I was always this to rally shout of Chris house again. He gave me the rally grants. This back on CD used to put CDs into the and our CD deck and our car. So right Ron LeGrande Ron. Sorry. Greg Pinneo, Larry Goins, all of those guys, and then Greg Pinneo really piqued my interest on the tax loopholes with buying. But just like the tax loopholes in it, if you had to buy houses. So my first buying hole to cash into a cash flow was a. 2012 I finally bought my first property 2012 Joe. Okay, section eight and again, like this is as I started last autumn, as I physically got into the experience of buying and holding, I'm up to two buying whole properties in 2012. It was some freaking leaky toilet cause.

Joe:   It was leaky toilet.

Antonio:  That leaky toilet calls the tenants dealing with tenants, dealing with tenants. And that was something. I really, I like I was getting a little bit of cash flow, but I realized I hated tenants. I didn't like that. I didn't like I like man, like. Okay. So they. Okay. They're saying by no properties, this is your loophole to save your taxes. Well, at least a start, the start of a secret to save more taxes. But I did not dealing with I didn't like I did not like the tenant part, man. I did not like the landlord part. I did not like it, I dreaded it, I dreaded it. I even had a little many, many, many, many property management company at the time for my two properties there still call me. Hey man, we got this plumbing issue. I met him at the part where my boy just took my whole day. Yeah, it just killed my. Well, yeah. All right. This. So shout out to my guy Scott. Scott, Joe. Like, I actually met him in 2011 at his restaurant. He owned at the time in Virginia Beach. And he was a guy that lost his S H I T in that crash.

Joe:   He lost. He lost everything.

Antonio:  Everything.

Joe:   Really cool story. And he we've had him on my podcast before.

Antonio:  He was like, this was one of many guy and guy like Joe said like, no, there's no on this on right. BRRRR strategy is not noted. Just put a name to that strategy. Yeah. Well he was the guy was doing burgers before the crash. League was in debt going, you know, taking, refinancing all my property, blah blah blah. And he lost it all. So that's what scares me today about these burgers, because these burgers haven't seen a crash yet, because we haven't had a crash in 2008. But that's a whole other story. Day 2011 Scott was starting over, and he was he was telling me about this, slow flight method. Right? And I'm like, cool. I like it, but I didn't really fully hear him because at 2012, I bought two, two set. I bought two properties for a section eight, but then I went back to work until I was like 12, 12. And I hate some thought that that slow flip model again, he's like, oh, it's like man. Like, yeah. Like you don't gotta do repairs. You don't gotta, you know, you just buying a property acquisition, you selling an owner financing. And I'm like, okay, I have one of my tenants and her leases coming up. I'm a convert her over to a slow flip. Right. Still. So still to this day. Joe, this is Miss Clark. This is my this is my first buying hold thousand 12 2000. Yeah. 2000 and gone 2013. I went back to Miss Clark. I said, how how'd you like to own his property? Oh, she's like, oh, I can't go to a bank. I don't have good credit. I was like, no, what? I'm going to finance you. She was Pam is I paid $12,000 for this property, by the way. 12,000 got. I figured this is a great recession. This the type of prices we were in. So she was paying me $7 a month for a 700. Only 12, $12,000 for. SoI she said yes to the conversion. I said, okay, you're going to be responsible for repairs. You're going to have ownership of the home. Right? And this is going to be your property. So that renewal started me renew her with at least I renewed her with the land contract or an agreement for De with the terms levels like 79,000 total for the property, she end up giving me $1,800 down right and start $700 a month. Just continue right this date. Same to this day. This is 12 now. This is 11 years later. Since the conversion, Joe, I have had no one call one. I have a one repair call, one leaky toilet. No, not nothing I don't even know. I mean, we look on our ledger and we see our money. She pays on time.

Joe:   I love this, this is, instead of being the landlord, you're being the bank.

Antonio:  You're literally the bank. Like, it just increases your return tremendously because there's no repairs in in the, in the investment zero.

Joe:   And let's go back to this to. Yeah. The taxes, which, by the way, if you're so concerned about taxes, I don't know why you moved to California.

Antonio:  Right. That's why I set myself up for that. But I news on paper, when you're back, you stay the same, right? All right, San Diego.

Joe:   I'm from San Diego. Yeah.

Antonio:  Okay. Yeah, yeah. Make us make a small story on a start. A small story on the California move. So we plan to move to California in 2019. Me and man. Okay. Are the half two kids. They're three and seven right now, so 2019. Marissa got pregnant. Unplanned. So that calls the whole move plan, right? So like okay. All right. So you're due and May of 2020. So okay. So maybe out the baby what we'll think about this. So then Covid happened in March of 2020 while she's pregnant. She due in May of 2020. Solike you know what like Arcadis this is not a good move. But you got to figure at well I didn't say this, but at 2019 we flew to California with an agent. We met in Asia. Their name is Kinsley. Showed us maybe like 12 houses and none of them were like likable to us. And it fit our box of our box, whatever. Right. But then randomly I'm a fast for she my, Marissa at our son Carter may of 2020. Basically like the heart of pandemic. Right. Particle it and they randomly I get up a call and email first and then a call from Kinsley August of 2020 and told, I got you to perfect house like this. This is the great time to get this house because like, the world is kind of like that. You can get really good deals. Yeah, really good deal. So I'm like this, we just had a baby. Marissa is like, she's going through this postpartum thing. She wasn't she wasn't mentally there. So I was like, I gotta and I, she showed me the house. I loved it, and I'm like, I gotta go sell my wrist. Like, this is I doubt if she's one of them. So it's not going to happen. But I showed her the property and Joe, she did not want to move. I said, baby, yeah I like this is a how this is it. Like, I know we plan this a year over a year ago. And I was like I said most of the times, like the stuff that you want don't come on your time. So she end up letting me lead the decision and we end up moving. She did not want to do it, but we end up moving in September of 2020 to California. Now, the reason why we are beginning, reason why we might not want to move in California because of my connections here, and it just fit both for our lifestyle. So now the taxes suck. We don't live in part of California where we're right over homeless people and stuff like that. We live in a great area, and just the people, the people I meet here, to me, trumps the other stuff that people talk about with dealing with California for me personally, and now it's not for everybody. I'm not familiar with a backpack and trying to go to Hollywood, trying to be in the next movie, or trying to blow up in the next song. Right. I can't you and I have to renew our mindset, right? Like just in my neighborhood, Joe is a massive, like, literally just in my neighborhood. Like, if I told you so many people that live in my neighborhood like our private money, come on my neighborhood, I have slow flip clients. In my neighborhood, I have a lot of my neighbors are my slow to the clients. They're buying multiple more smaller properties. And one of my clients last week he said Antonio, my mom in law has $1 million. Can you help us? It falls on my lap. It literally I was on that that. So I have access to too much money for the type of deals that I buy. But that's okay. That's okay. I just love the opportunities that come, come out of this area is so easy for me. And even if you lived here, Joe, you will find it. Really?

Joe:   Yeah. California is a near and close place to my heart. I was I was born, like I said, I was born in L.A., lived right, and I was raised in San Diego. And then I've even lived in Bakersfield and San Francisco. Yeah. So I my mom's still out there. I go out there all the time. So I give people who live in California a hard time, but it's all in love, all right? It's all in love. And by the way, you brought up a really good point because there is a lot of money in California, and these buyers are looking for deals. They want to invest in deals. Yeah. And they're they can't get cash flow in California. So where are they looking. They're looking in markets like Saint Louis or Indianapolis. Cleveland, Ohio. Yeah. Florida. Yeah. Parts of Florida.

Antonio:  Yeah. So and when I show them that, when I bring in when I introduced a slow flip model to the are 50 60 K properties, you got you got to figure like this is California. Where do you find follow what's what 50 like the actual house. Where is it. Just like is it on fire? I'm like no, like my in fact, here's my property that I just purchased for 50 to 5. And I look at it and like, oh man, can I get five of those? And is boom. Is this that mindset here is like 50 K to a lot of people here. Not a lot of people here. It is just a peanut. So is to me. I have no competition when it comes to that here. When I'm presenting this slow flip method and how we build the infrastructure, we don't have to do repairs and can they can be hands off.

Joe:   And people think, because I want to talk about this, people think you're crazy. Yeah, that there are deals that you can actually buy for under $60,000. So let's talk about this. This is the slow flip strategy. Yeah. Scott's been on my podcast talking about it. You have a little different twist on it. Yeah I think you buy your properties a little bit higher than Scott does. Which gets you a little bit nicer properties is what Scott buys and use. So the whole concept of this and correct me if I'm wrong here, the whole concept of a slow flip deal is a way to get the cash flow out of real estate, to buy assets without being the landlord. So you buy a cheap property, oftentimes with private money, private investors money, and you pay them off in 5 to 10 years, about five years, right?

Antonio:  Five years on that.

Joe:   And then you sell you sell that deal on 30 year owner finance. So you so your cash flow is not very much at all. The first five years you're paying off that private money. But then the. Next 25 years. So you own this property now, free and clear, and you're getting a tremendous amount of cash flow from real estate without the hassles of managing tenants and being a landlord. Is that right?

Antonio:  Yeah, you're spot on, Joe. Yeah. The goal here, I call it. Yeah. If you people that buy these cash, you're buying cash. You're getting cash on day one, right? You're getting a high return 2,020% cash, low cash return on a low in up to 3,035% cash on cash. Usually our sweet spot is 25%. Cash on cash return is the bottom cash. But you also have the people that are buy these, you know, leverage private money. And I call that the free house method. So the reason why I call it the free house method is because you're using private money to acquire these assets. Right? But you're not making cash flow on day one. You actually want to break even for 60 months because you're borrowing private money for, for five years. I'm paying I'm putting my private money lender. This is how I raise private money. This is one method I always problem when I'm like, hey, hey, mister, private money lender. Hey Joe, I'm actually putting you first for five years. I'm putting myself second, right? Because the reason why I don't put myself second is because I want to give you a great return. 12% annualized interest is that which I pay my lender. But on a 61st month right now, I get to eat right because you're paid off, but unwilling to be patient for five years to pay you your return for five years. All right, so I'm going to break even on purpose to pay you your return. So that's how I usually pitch or. Yeah, this I basically pitched my primary lenders and they love the model. They love it. They're like oh wow. So you're willing to break even with this? They're not used to that concept. Like you, you're not going to make any cash for five years. But I call that the free house method. I'm basically buy myself a free house.

Joe:   And the cool thing is, it's not as hard as you guys might think to find the private investors that are willing to lend this money and these private money investors, they're very well protected. Because why don't you give us an example deal of what? You know, you're coming out to Saint Louis. Hopefully we're going to golf. Yes, a little bit together when you're here in probably less than a month. Yep. So that'll be cool to hang out and talk about this more. Maybe we can do another podcast or do some videos while you're here or something. I'm a video guy, by the way. Remind me, Rob, my video guy can come and, we can film some content if you want.

Antonio:  Yeah, that'd be cool, man. I love to do it.

Joe:   Okay, cool. All right, well, so give us an example. Deal. Of a typical deal that you might find in a market like Saint Louis.

Antonio:  Yeah. So my typical buy box for myself and what my clients buy. Now, let me go back, backtrack about a year. Right. We've been buying in your market, Saint Louis and the surrounding Illinois market for nearly two years a year. I'm just say less than a year ago. We can buy 25, 30,000 properties. Turkey. Yeah, Turkey. And I'll go borrow the $30,000 from a private money lender five years and use it $30,000, 12%, five, or of course, a five years, $667.30. And you can have the free house method, the break even method. But those are been brought out that are turnkey.

Joe:   Now when you say turnkey, what do you mean by that?

Antonio:  Like when I say turnkey, some of them are slightly rehabbed. You know, like they were slightly rehab, some of them rent ready. Regret is what I call it. Turnkey. Wait. Ready. Move in. Ready property Turkey. There is no leaks. There's no new carpet, sometimes new laminate floors. The kitchen has a basic new cabinets. I'm talking about that, right? Those type of conditioned properties, in my personal opinion, have been all brought up. Now they're you can triple calls one every now and then, but like again nearly a year ago, less than a year ago, you can just go on MLS and Zillow. And it was a it was an abundance of like so many both now a slow flip. Buyers are slow flippers right. We see a lot of us right now and we bought them up in that price range. However there are still people that spot them in that price range buying property in that price range. But they need a lot of work. So my bar box change in a lot of my clients because I still like that condition property. So we're buying properties 40 to 60 K on average. Our my sweet spot lately has been hovering around a 50 K mark. Same type of property is actually in a better class area is now like a seat and sometimes B class area 50 K and I have no issues. I mean we have a better quality slope up tenant slope. The back of it is in a better class area. They pay better. Does the return go down a little bit. Yeah. But I'm still hovering on a low end. Like I said earlier 20%. If you're paying cash for these properties it's a 20% cash on cash return. But worst case you're breakeven. Because if I buy a so we have a property, I touch your actual property when we get off. So maybe we can share some pictures or I'm buying a property. We're close on this Friday. I say three I think so three one all brick with a carport. And if you see the if you see the condition at his house is like, geez, like I'm getting it for 52 552 five, we can get probably no. And I'm just so, so numbers wise, we honor finance these properties on the back end on a on a total sale price. Or they say because this rope in the numbers about 52 five and one owner finance it for. 89. These are the projected numbers because I haven't got it. I stop with close on the first before we fill it with an on it, but I'm buying, say the two five. We want to get 89, projected to get 89 nine on the back end. Total sales price for down. So that owner occupier is going to bring 4K nonrefundable down, which leaves our balance at 85 nine. So we're going to finance 8590 by pay me $1,300 a month over the course of 30 years. Now if I borrow I'll borrow I wouldn't borrow 52 five. I'll borrow $50,000 from a private money lender. $50,000, 12% over the course of five years is $1,022, I believe $0.22. So 1122. So that's still a breakeven method because tax and insurance, if I get $1,300 on occupant, I'm basically breaking it with a five year because up to 30 30 K properties. But I just popped it up. I can get a little more for this 30 all break three bedroom, one bath house with a carport.

Joe:   You're buying it for about $50,000?

Antonio:  Yep.

Joe:   And you're selling it for about $90,000 on owner finance plus interest. But it works out to be where the person buying it with owner financing their total payments about the same as what it would be if it was rent. Is that right?

Antonio:  Correct. Literally. Yeah.

Joe:   And you’re doing it as a land contract. So. Or contract for deed.

Antonio:  Yeah. Contract for deed or some people call land contract. Yeah. So I'll do a land contract which spells out the terms. I just said 89,000. Was your down payment down in the 4000, the balance would be 89. -4000 would be 85. Not. And I have the interest to break down the monthly payment of the 85. Not so $1,300. What would interest be for 3085 now? All of course 30 years. Now we need to break out a calculator for that. But just say 12.92% interest, right? Yeah. That will all spell out in the contract. Basically the four terms between myself and the owner and also spelling out that they are responsible for the repairs as well. So I'm in California. This property is in the Midwest. I do not want to get a leg. It's all a call it. It's just not the case. That is non-negotiable for me. Okay, so I'm writing some notes here because I got a lot of questions I want to yeah, I want to ask you, why don't you do. Why don't you just give the seller the. I'm sorry. Why don't you just give the buyer the deed to the property so that you're not even on title anymore? So if something does happen, it's totally 100% on the buyer that's in the property. Does that makes sense?

Antonio:  Yeah, that's a great question. I like to be in the driver's seat 24 seven with this with was with control. And I feel like I'm losing some control if I provide the deed to the owner occupant, because now I can't evict I'm like a tenant. Now with the agreement for D backtrack a little bit. With the agreement for D or the land contract, we still hold the deed to the property. So the deed is still in our name or my name. Right? Mark. Up until they paid me off and for the 30 years. Or buy me out very rarely their buy me out would just say they go live for 30 years. Now they get the D versus if we do a the traditional owner finance method, they get the deed at closing. Now I'm really in the passenger seat because if they default, I have to go through the whole foreclosure process, which can take God knows how long, right? Versus a the land contract if they default, right. It's a 2 to 3 month eviction process. Simple. Get them out in 2 to 3 months for an eviction process with a land contract. My marketing team comes in. We rest on repeat. Yeah, a whole new owner occupied I a new four 4K down and do 8099 and maybe probably more of that those two because these owner occupiers really go and fix up these houses a lot of cases. So they made to put carpet into the property, maybe do some new paint. Right. Maybe they say this house is brick, right? Because this is the rope, the house I'm talking about. It's brick. Maybe they painted the outside from that regular brick LED color to white. That boost available? Not quite a property from a 2 or 3 month eviction versus a year or. Now I'm a foreclosure, right? I can probably get seven k down instead of $13, but if I can get 1500 a month. So I look at it from the back end, the back end aspect that what they agree with for D versus a traditional owner financing. I rather keep the deed because it keeps me in the driver's seat versus I mean, in any event that they default on the property, I kind of victim like a tenant with just one of the best.

Joe:   Okay. So, what on average do you see as a default rate for these land contract buyers?

Antonio:  Oh, man. Like 1 to 2%. You gotta figure like it is very low. And lastly, sometimes me a mascot, I'd say, hey, you got evictions lately? Oh, man, I bought x amount of properties. I have zero evictions I had in my three in my last three years. Joe, I had I know this sounds too good to be true. I have one of the one full of the have. I have some people that defaulted. Yes, but by tile we may be like call or text and maybe put like a little five day notice on the door. They pay, they pay. One eviction in my last three years. One eviction, like is insane because you think about it. Yeah. Put yourself in their shoes like 3 to 5 K down as average of what we get nonrefundable down for these slow flips. Right. That is a lot of money for the for the type of people that we're still these properties in. Right. They may make 50 K a year or 40 K a year. They have I don't know if 2000 saved up because I do ask for a bank statement. What we that that the right about k I mean we're asking a thousand off of this property. They got $2,200 saved up. That's pretty typical right. And they say they got another lump sum coming from somewhere, I guess, where they didn't have to sell the property next three months. But if they give me, you know, this, a $3,000 nonrefundable down for an example. Right. And over the course of just say two years before they default it, they put a cumulative over two years, 10,000 to the property. That's hard to walk away from for average person. That's very hard. They may get laid. We may call and say, hey, no, we don't want to do this, but we might put a notice on the door for eviction. And then we do put on notice and they see like, hey, we're going to, you know, get the attorney involved to start the eviction process. Now. Now before knocks on the top, his pay is paid through the ledger on our portal. I don't get much eviction at this. Hard to say man.

Joe:   I wonder so if it would be the same if you gave them the deed to the property. If and you know once they were late, you give them a notice of default and you get really aggressive and starting that procedure, that process. I'm not an expert in foreclosures and I need to get more information on that. But if you start the process early enough, you could get the deed back in foreclosures within 3 to 4 months. But you can also negotiate with them, which it sounds like what you already are doing. You tell them, hey, listen, you know, you're in default. You need to catch up or we're going to kick you out. And most of the time you can get them to get back. You can also adjust or modify the loan. Here's my concern, my fear. Rather I'm going to get I'm going to get a, a threatening letter from the county saying, hey, this property that you own is not being taken care of. You need to, you need to take care of it. Or getting a letter from the not a letter. Rather like being featured on the on the local news saying, hey, this slum landlord owns all these properties and he's not taking care of them. And look at these properties. They're they need a bunch of work. And they could look in county records and see who owns these properties and sees that. Yeah, he's just he's really just renting them out. But he's calling it something different. Like, wouldn't it be better, wouldn't you be more safe just dealing the property to these buyers? Does that make sense?

Antonio:  Yeah. And that aspect of how you how you're how you're. Thank you. Yes. However, I don't think personally I could sleep like a baby at night knowing that I did it all. So they say if one is out. But one of my markets is this, is Birmingham, Alabama, right now in Birmingham, Alabama, or it's state Alabama. If I did a land contract in Alabama and I do lease options in Alabama, I know you're big on these arches. I actually do lease optional Alabama. I don't prefer these arches, but the reason why I do a lease option Alabama is because if I declare a contract, it'll take 12 to 18 months for a foreclosure process. And I don't want to go through the hell of 12, 18 months of foreclose and then nonpayment, and they're dragging out that fast on the carpet. I'm cool on that. So I do a lease option so that because that brings me back to the fact that it's a 2 to 3 month eviction. But to your point, as far as like getting letters from the city or being like on the news or whatnot, it goes back to my point of why I like a good product are like turnkey properties. I used to be huge on buying a specialty in my garden because another one that's my that's my hometown market. That's where I started buying slow flips until it almost got nearly impossible to find properties on the 60 K when the pandemic happened. But we'll I'll buy a property. Freaking kitchen fire this freaking on fire on finance and slow flip it out of the next seven days like let others or less in and it still blows my mind away, to this day, that you could slow flip anything and that yes, you can slow flip anything but to your point earlier like it. Also you slow flip it to a person where they are responsible for the repairs. You usually getting handyman in the aspect as you slow flat to they're dragging their ass now. It kind of haunts you on the back end because next thing you know, as a city violation on it, who's like, oh, come back to me now. I'm calling back the handyman that I sell that be to like, hey man, I got this letter, blah, blah blah, what's going on? Like, why fix the kitchen? Why do blah, blah blah blah. Oh yeah. Well, now we're going to get 22 months. I'm like, well, I have a deadline here. I have a letter like you deserve. You're responsible for it for this. So I got tired of that aspect. So I changed my Bible and that's this is like doesn't happen every day. This is so rare. But it still had. My product is Turkey Joe, I forget I was. I'll send you some pictures. Of what? The one I'm posting on Fridays. You kind of see a general idea of what I'm buying, but my clients come into my community. And because my model is turnkey, but I have a slow flip, I'm sorry, cash flow, innovative model where people come into my program and I'm actually hand in. These people are slow for the deal. We're building a property for them. Right. And you got to figure these my clients most of the time they aren't and they are entrepreneurs. But I'm not real estate investor. So for an example, one of my clients live in Tampa, Clearwater area, you know, owns a yachting company, right? I don't steer right. Given him a property that needs a ton of repairs and he may call me back. Hey, man, I pay for your program, man. Like I got this sticker on the door versus the problem paint. I'm actually buying this Friday. If I handed him that property for an example, Turkey doesn't need any work more than ready. And if he actually pay cash for that property, a 52 $5,000 a month on day one, we can all sleep like a baby at night.

Joe:   Yeah, I'm telling you, man, this is exciting because I am looking at properties right now in Saint Louis on Redfin, I am listening, I know this is disrespectful.

Antonio:  And you find there is an abundance of these properties and is.

Joe:   The savings are nice. You go ahead. Just right now, if you're watching this or listening to this, go to Redfin or Zillow and look for properties priced between 40 and $60,000. In Saint Louis, Missouri, the whole metro area, large Illinois and Missouri side, and some of these properties, three bed, two bath in decent areas you look at, it just needs cosmetics, maybe carpet and paint. Yeah, these are rent ready. They really are. And you could sell these things all day long with owner financing. Easy or land.

Antonio:  I just texted you check, check your check. I just sent you to one of those got the text

Joe:  Holy cow. That's nice. That looks like $120,000 property.

Antonio: You see? I just text it on the property immediately. It pinged on his side. He said, Holy cow. You saw his reaction that that is my problem. That is my product, Joe. That's why I buy those products in that fifth year. I like that, I just like when my clothes, cars come in aqua bottom, that I'm not getting any, that no sticker, no inspections, no. You have to get occupancy permits, which you need those in those markets. Easy, easy $39 a month. We're going to put your project together. If I we might shoot for 1400 just because it's brick and it just looks nice.

Joe:  Yeah. This is it's a good area. Yeah. Talk about occupancy permits. Some areas require that some don't. Yes. But in order to if warranted for somebody to live in that house, whether they own it or rent it, they have to get an occupancy inspection or explain that.

Antonio:  Yeah. So that was something we, we, we, didn't really I knew of them, but like, we really affected us when we start buying your, your market in Saint Louis in the summer surrounding Illinois market, you know, the Cahokia and all of that was we start by no. And that's one. And I was like, no way. I'm still buying better then unlike what you see.

Joe:   Because I know this looks like it's just rehab, that it's staged.

Antonio:  That's my point. And you see, look you see it was a reduction. I take a reduction in his invest. I was like, no, 52 five freak it. Yeah. Works is still works. But yeah, the occupancy permits is basically what once like Joe says, once you buy it, you know, once you own it as you as an owner, or if you rent it out to a tenant per se. Right. These this the county or the city goes out and they expect these houses like if there's freaking section inspections inspectors. Yeah. And they see these houses, any leaks, any structural damage. Any is the roof decent enough for the windows? Decent enough is like, this is. Wow. Before they even, offer occupancy permit. So I feel like, again, like I want to sleep like a baby at night, whether it's from my cell phone corner or from one of my Castle Innovator clients coming in and, providing the product, we can both sleep like a baby because I'm providing a livable, turnkey shape product where you can get super rich on the back end east on day one.

Joe:   And you're doing some good for the community, too, aren't you?

Antonio:  Absolutely. We're providing affordable housing to people like, no, they can't go to banks. And some people may be thinking about this like, oh, like, you know, these people must have bad credit. You'd be surprised that, I have quite a few Joe people that have good credit, but they haven't done their taxes in 2 to 3 years because they're, they're, self-employed and they're entrepreneurs. So we're providing houses to these people as well. And I actually had three buy me out on the pandemic, actually, as, as, just three months ago, I have one buy me out the property I had in Hampton, Virginia. Because they have to. Yeah. Hampton, Virginia. The guy brought me out. I actually he brought me out. I think his, his, $450,000 was his balance. And then I bought some numbers. I brought this property 2019 to rehab for, 45 K. I'll put 25 into it. So I was in it for 70 K. My, my goal was to fix and flip put on a market for 129, and get a. You know, Buck rack and is set on the market. Once upon a market again, my intent was to fix and flip, not to slow, flat and sell on the market for 30 days. And I call my agent Jeanette, my Jeanette, like, we're not gonna bite. She's like, oh, so you got like, two showings, but nothing. No offers? No, not many calls. Oh my. Why was okay. So this was in the 2019 like before the pandemic. So I was like, no, what? Let me go against my grain. I'm just going to refi because I borrowed money on it for the certification slip. I bought, 12 months money on it. I was going I probably lenders Julie, and I was like, you know what? I'm just going to I rehabbed it, let me go against my grain and borrow some 30 year money on it. Right. You know, refi and that's what I did I refi and I actually refi it. I got I did for 75 K. So I basically walked away with a couple grand because I was in it for 70. And I go outside and I pay my lender off. And my monthly payment was, I don't know, like 400 and change. It was cheap. Yeah. On the change. So I slow flip it out for 129 nine. Right. I got ten K down. Nonrefundable. Gotta figure this is a rehab property and I ended up getting $1,100 a month. My mortgage payment was 400 and change. So I got ten K down up front. Yeah 129 back. And so his balance is 199. And he's end up my my slow for that period of time that bought me out three months ago. He was paying me $11 a month. So I was loving it. I was okay cool I love it, you know? And then next thing I know, in December of last year, I was like one of my property management girls. He said, hey, 40 Harbert bro wants to buy you out. I said, okay, damn. It's like, damn, I was enjoying it. No, $7,000 a month. Sounds like cool. He wants to know about it. So we sent his bouncing his bounced, like, 115 and change vacation, maybe. And I went. I went in my ledger or my portal to see what my balance was, because I borrow 75 K and I think was like 68 and change. So I'm okay. Well, you know what 150 -68 okay. That's 32 plus 13 is $47,000. I can just go buy me one more. Snowflake was free and clear, so he bought me out three months ago. Joe. And that's exactly what I did. I took that money, went into your mortgage, really? And bought me a. Yeah, a 45,000 a house. So now I own a player and that 45,000 houses get me 1050 a month. So I went from my loan that debt for 30 years. Paid it off because my solar bar bought me out, got basically $45,000 in change. And at the close of calls and I'm going to go about 45,000 on a house in your Saint Louis market, free and clear. And that's giving me ten, 15 months.

Joe:   I love this. Okay, let's go back to my earlier question, though. Yeah, for some reason. And I've talked to Scott Jelinek a lot about this.

Antonio:  Yeah.

Joe:   Just go ahead. Don't call me a wuss. Scaredy cat like I, I'm I'd rather just give even if I have to go through the foreclosure process. Even if it takes six I'd rather just deed the property to the buyer. Right. So is that okay? Or do you think now that's a stupid move and yeah. Does that make sense now?

Antonio:  It does make sense. I think it's a personal preference. I just hear her way. More horror stories foreclose on people versus as dignity. I me personally, I just I've heard way more horror stories.

Joe:   Yeah. Okay. Could you do a deed in lieu of foreclosure?

Antonio:  Possibly I could, yeah. You could. You want to give that did away with this model you like? Oh man I'm looking at these properties in my work. I see an abundance of them. Your exit. You actually want to do a traditional owner finance review?

Joe:   Maybe I'm just concerned about liability. I'm concerned about being in the local news. Right. Because, like, there's a guy, in Saint Louis. His name is. Was he. He passed away, lit, lit. He had a huge company in Saint Louis. That owner financed a ton of homes, hundreds, if not thousands of them. And when the market crashed, he went down in flames. And he was committing a lot of mortgage fraud. So the, but he was doing a lot of land contracts, and I part of me in the back of my minds, like, I don't want to be that guy. I don't. And he when it came out of the local news, what he was doing, that whole thing, people just don't understand it when they're looking at it from the outside. And I don't know, that's I'm wrestling with it. And I've talked to Scott about this and he keeps on telling me, would you just stop? Joe? You sound like one of my students that are. Yeah, whining and complaining. Well, this doesn't work. So it works. It does. Okay, I, I need to, I need to.

Antonio:  But here's another thing. Here's another asset protection, that I personally do. And my clients come into my castle in a beta program outside of Saint Louis. I know you can't do this in Saint Louis, but we do buy an abandoned home in Illinois market, right? And obviously Virginia, Birmingham, Alabama. I put our property on that trust now, probably in the verses and probably not a percent of the people that watch this, they probably put properties, if I hope not a personal name, but probably an LLC. Right. A limited liability company. You still sticking your head out for lease properties? That and you're easy to find. You're. I can look up. Anybody know? Limited live with like, owns a problem like. Oh, Tony, I was on I was at company. Oh, Joe McConnell was that company. You know you can't find me in a land tries. Good luck. Shout out to Riley Granite. Put me on to that in 2009 for you know and I've been using Elantra since 2000 I'm heavy on that predator. Predator. And if anybody just know their tenant, any other occupant, they can sue the freaking laterals. They can or any and let alone, I mean, if you go on to the part where, like you been on the news. Yeah. One, two, three Main Street Land Trust. And then my next property. 323 McCall Land Trust. They're all address land trust. They're going to be calling out the address on the news because that was yeah. You know, that's the record is the land trust. So all my like a piece I put in my address land trust and that shows all the attached record. Now behind the land trust is the agreement that never that's never public information that's never on the public. Right. That's just from my personal files. Only they can't that I'm oblivious to the world when you buy properties. And so now my company, my LLC, in my holdings company that is the owner of my land trusts, but nobody knows it. They don't even know what my name my companies are. They just see the address land trust. So again, outside of Saint Louis, where I'm forced to put properties in my holdings company because you can't do land trust there. That one sucks. But I buy in on multiple other markets where Virginia or Alabama, Ohio, the Illinois.

Joe:   You could still have it in an LLC, but then have a registered agent, correct. As the as the address of the LLC, which could be an attorney. Correct. So like they still couldn't know that you owned it if you had a registered agent. That's but this is really awesome. Got a couple questions quick for you, and I appreciate your time. Yeah. Oh, and I have I do have to go here, too. I just remember some. How do you find the how do you find good buyers for your deals?

Antonio:  That's a great question, Joe. If she would probably expect me to say some crazy, sophisticated way. Facebook Marketplace. Yeah, I love we love Facebook Marketplace. And the reason? So few reasons. One is easy to vet. No reason not to judge a book by its cover and whatnot, but I can go to a profile, I mean, their Facebook page and look at their profile, look at pics. And they look promising. And most of the conversation is messages. I personally have my marketing team that fill all our properties, but to me, messages and emails and text these days is a form of, like a contract because you can go back. Oh, I didn't say that. He didn't say that. Hey, we're you know, this Facebook message here on July 21st, 2023. You said this. Oh, I'm sorry, I disagree, but yeah, I can vet the person what they look like making sure they don't have not. No, no profile pic, snorting coke on a freaking pic or some 52 Henny bottles. Right? You know, they're looking reasonable. They got a family. They look promising. So I've read that, and it's just easy to find. Like you, we could. We could put like that, probably. I sent you, Joe. It's going to be a multiple, multiple offer situation. My properties in that product you see are multiple offers do like these are and was it 21 or 31 I can't remember.

Joe:   Two bed, one bath. Yeah 912ft².

Antonio:  Yeah. That's going to be multiple offices to which I love like versus the ones that need a lot of work they take maybe I mean they still take they still fill fast two weeks whatever. Next day I get a next day, next day to two max market team. Hey, we got we got 4K, down 89, dated on, 13 last month. I got another offer, two hours later we got another offer, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. And then I'll let them fight over it. Next thing I knew, I may end up getting five K down $3,000, or maybe three K down and $1,400. I would not pick and choose. I made that and fight over it.

Joe:   So yeah. So do you have to do license loan originators, mortgage originators to do this? Or is it just you have your own prequalify pre-qualification?

Antonio: Yeah I don't work I yeah I have my own pre pre qualifications. I know people ask me about the usury laws and whatnot as well. But yeah like the deed the deeds are getting transferred along with that. And then also with the Dodd-Frank act, people are asking about that. Hey, what about the doc? Forget, you know, you can't do pass. Thank you. So three, three properties a year, something like that. Yeah. I mean, the doctors get a DS are getting transferred with, with this model. Well, going to your point, if you did the, the traditional. Yeah. Model, the DS a good transfer. So now could it trigger the offering act? Possibly. Yes. More. Yeah. Yeah.

Joe:   So the deed does get transferred. You have to use a licensed loan originator. You are to get to, to pre-qualify these folks, which makes it harder to find buyers if you have to use a licensed loan originator. Right.

Antonio:  Yeah. One of the I guess another advantage of using the land contract, the slow lip models, the  aren't getting transfer at all. Right.

Joe:   Well, Antonio, man, this has been so good. Oh, yeah, I got we related that. I'm sorry. Before we move on, how do you prescreen your buyers? There's. Do you look for, like, certain income? Yeah. What background check do you do? That kind of stuff?

Antonio: I don't do any background checks. Far as credit checks. I mean, if they're having felonies, we don't. We don't check into that. We. I checked for that. The down payment, the down payment and job verification. That's all I care about. I just care about the down payment and job verification. Let me know that you can afford the thousand or $11 a month. That's all I care about. Because if not, it just defeats the purpose of this whole model. Redoing credit checks. Yeah, well, you got you got, evicted, you know, two times in the last two years, so you're disqualified. We don't do any of that. You gotta figure these people put in three, 4 or 5 K down. To me, that is a that's a major qualifier in a box to check off on my part, which they can never get back anyway. So they think they're going to that's nonrefundable. And as long as they got a job that maybe they work and they've been working at Best Buy for four years. And, you know, the center of sales, marketing and making no. 40 K a year. And then they got a oh, they say as a mom working at Best Buy, she got a boyfriend as bringing that extra 25 K I'll take it all day long. Take it all day. So job verification and down payment and oh, I also I've been lazy with this as a part of my last ten, but usually I ask for at least one .

Antonio:  I've been lazy with this y last ten, slow flip purchases. But you. I usually ask for a one month bank statement. Make it easy peasy for these people to come in and get qualified. Job verification. And obviously the down payment,  you can you can make that down payment up.

Joe:   Yeah. Scott Jelinek is even more, even less strict. It's like the first one to bring the money. Yeah, because then you can never get accused of discrimination. It's just the first qualified one that brings the money. Yep. That's what he does. Oh, yeah. Cool. All right. Man. Antonio, how can people get hold of you? Are you active on the social medias and YouTubes and stuff like that?

Antonio:  Yeah. Of course. I mean, you two probably have over 200 videos. I just YouTube Antonio Edwards real estate. I know I probably pop up from that. Subscribe to that Instagram. A more active lot of the TikToks or Facebook's, or lately as I'm more active on Instagram. So Antonio underscore the letter J underscore Edwards and is I know we didn't talk about this, but I have for my slow flip clients I have a whole SS program built for our slow flippers coming out. By the time you l, I think you said three weeks. The phase one would be launched, and I'm super pumped about this is geared towards slow flip deals going to be in there. Your CRM, you can manage a slow flip occupancy. I'm gonna have I built an there where it it automatically sends out to people that's late calls text with I in it and you can has pre-built and insurance qualifiers in there for you to ensure your properties is have is so much is so I know you got to go, man. This is a cool program. But , you can go to innovator.com right now. There's a waitlist right now for but like I said, by the time you launched his podcast, phase one should be should be out now. I'm super duper pumped about that, man, because I've been working on this for almost a year.

Joe:   Cash flow innovator.com. Yep. I'm going to go there right now and join the waitlist myself man.

Antonio:  It's going to disrupt the whole slow flip industry. So people out and stuff that this is, is solving my problems. And I know I've been in this game for so long with bias slow flips is good. Is going to solve every slow problem outside of fun. Everybody funding. Right? Right. But all the issues that come with the slow flips it’s going to solve so many problems. Man, I can't wait.

Joe:   Well, this looks really good.

Antonio:  This is going to be the first SaaS or software in the slow flip industry ever.

Joe:   Nice I love it. Yeah. Cash flow innovator.com I'm there right now. I'm going to join the waitlist. Yes, sir. And this is good Antonio thanks for being on the show man I appreciate you guys. He is more active on Instagram, but he's also got a lot of good videos on YouTube teaching this stuff, diving deeper into this strategy. Looking forward to hanging out with you when you come to Saint Louis. Maybe go to a Cardinals game, play some golf, love to hang out with you, Antonio. It'd be good, man.

Joe:   Appreciate you too. We'll see you guys later. Take care everybody. Bye bye.

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