Joe: Welcome. This is the Real Estate Investing Mastery podcast. What's going on, everybody? JoeMcCall, Real Estate Investing Mastery podcast, and I think we're live here. I'm sorry, I'm getting all kinds of pop ups on my screen, so who knows? I may not be, but you're here. And how do I know you're listening? Well, I have my ways. I know these things. Well that's kind of creepy. But you're here and you're listening to this. I really appreciate it. Guys, welcome. This is the Real Estate Investing Mastery podcast. And I got a good guest here. His name is Trevor Mauch. I've had him on my podcast four times before. So you must know I really like this guy. And Trev and I go way back. He is the founder, the creator of one of my favorite tools, Carrot. What? I thought there was a vegetable. No, joelikescarrots.com. Are you kidding me? It's the number one real estate investors website. It's more than just a website. It's an entire platform that Trevor built from the ground up. It's just amazing. It's incredible. But we're going to be talking about the data of how he got, check this out, listen, 197,679 motivated buyer and seller leads so far in 2021, almost 200,000 motivated buyer and seller leads so far in 2021. Like, what the heck, where does that come from? Where's the where's the momentum going to, where is it heading to? So if there's anybody that understands the data in the real estate investing space, it's Trevor Mauch because he is the number one platform for online lead generation and he's got really simple, powerful, point-and-click websites that you can create for your own business. I've been a huge Carrot fan for a long, long time, a proud supporter recommendation. I've recommended Carrot sites for a long time. I even got a domain: joelikescarrots.com, because carrots are really, really good for you. But we're also going to be showing you the motivated seller lead source that's converting 250 percent better so far in 2021. And again, this is Trevor who knows his stuff and he's been in the business a long time. We just hang out, hung out was it yesterday? Two days ago.  

Trevor: Two days ago. And you missed, you missed the most fun of the whole time, which was getting stuck in the elevator with me here.

Joe:  I saw a picture of you getting like ten of you or twelve of you in an elevator.

Trevor: You're not giving us enough credit. I mean, there were fourteen of us. And so we apparently don't know how to count. So I was one of the first ones in the elevator, Joe, and people kept piling in. I'd only drank one drink the entire night. So I wasn't drunk or anything because I had to fly out the next day. Fourteen of us in an elevator did not work out well, but we got along. Forty-five minutes with Tim Broths, the Neil Claman, Patrick Riddle Francis, great group though. Could not have been a better group so. But my best one week was a blast man was fun hanging out with you.

Joe: Did anyone go to the bathroom, like was everybody cool?

Trevor: Yeah, everyone was cool. The fire department had to literally come to get us out of this thing, and we got out. And then, me and Ken and some of the guys headed home.

Joe: I thought that was a joke. I saw the picture on Facebook and you guys look like you were just having a good time. But that fun, the picture I saw, it was funny. Your face, though, was all contorted like it did not look happy.

Trevor: I think he caught me in between. He told me to make a funny face. He cut me right in between that moment. But I thought it was fun. If we were saying that over the forty-five minutes, it would have been it probably would have shifted from fun to to agony. It was cool. But it was amazing seeing you there. So, so cool seeing everybody in this mastermind's past four or five, six, seven, some of us ten years just grow and proud of the work you guys are doing.

Joe: It's if those of you wondering what we're talking about, it's a little mastermind that Trevor Mauck started with Patrick Riddel called the Amplified Mastermind. And I've been honored and privileged, I remember when you guys first asked me to come five years ago maybe or something, I was like “Me? Serious? This dude?” Like, yeah, come on, Joe, be cool. I said, all right, sign me up. And it's been a it's a once a year thing that we do. Super awesome. It was in Charleston, South Carolina, which is a crazy, awesome city. I love going to one of my favorites, some of the best restaurants that I've ever been to are there, hands down. Yeah. That that one restaurant, we don't I don't want to tell anybody the name of it because it'll become too popular. But like that last place, we went to it with really healthy food. I've never tasted healthy food so good.

Trevor: That was so good. We did it the last Charleston one, a few years ago. Amazing food. Amazing food, you guys. If you have not been in Charleston, South Carolina, put it on the list. I've been there probably seven or eight times and every single time I love it.

Joe: So we should say the name of that restaurant, though. Do you remember the name?

Trevor: It was something Table. I can't remember what the name of it was, honestly.

Joe: It’s a health food, I feel like it's a place I'm sure vegans love to eat at, but they have fish. I think they had a little bit of steak salad. It seemed like a vegetarian style vibe restaurant. Not vegetarian, but a vegan like that.

Trevor:  It was a little crispy, a little crispy. The food is amazing though. Man it's amazing.

Joe: All right, cool. So I said, well, what do you want to talk about, Trevor? And I love having you on my show because you bring the good, you talk the data. I love data, not drama. And you said, hey, let's talk about how we've managed over almost two-hundred-thousand motivated buyer and seller leads so far in 2021. And where are they coming from? Where are they, where's the momentum heading to? So, what do you seeing going on right now in this crazy world.

Trevor: So let me, let me share my screen, if I can, (Speaker 1) Will it let you? Get to what I'm going to do, guys, is this and we don't we don't do this often. I kind of first started doing it after covid hit a year ago and we did it. I think you might you and I might have even done it early. And this would be kind of a cool little updates. What I'm going to do is this is I had it pulled just from the first….

Joe: Let me interrupt you real quick. If you're listening to this on the audio podcast, please just go to my YouTube channel and you'll see this on the video there. And you can make it big screen. But go to just YouTube, search for Joe Macall and you'll find this podcast there.

Trevor: And I'll explain. I'll do my best to explain kind of visually what we're seeing if you guys are just listening to this. So I'm going to I'm going to give a little recap of this past year, because guys and gals in the real estate market, it's been a while. We went from before COVID hit. I think a lot of us were looking at going, man, when is this train going to stop? You know, the real estate market's been a hot market for years. It's been an upswing for well over a decade now. And if you look at kind of market trending, it's usually that eight to ten, eight to eleven years when something shifts in some sort of a correction. And I know for me, going into 2020, I was thinking that man, probably second quarter, third quarter of the year when you start to see something softening and I don't know if that would have happened if it didn't hit, I don't know. But when COVID hit there was that initial two, three weeks. I'll show you on the on the data then I'll show you what we're seeing today in 2021. The first two or three weeks, I think everyone wasn't sure what was going to happen. Is the whole market going to tank because of this? So this is what we saw happen. And so if we were to kind of hover over here, let's look at this. This is February 27^th, 2020. And I'm just going to I'm going to verbalize this as much as I can for the podcast listeners here. So I'm hovering over this thing: 42,866 people landed on our client's websites on the day of Thursday, February 27th. And then if we start to get into March now, March 2nd, I was still around the forty-five thousand or so.

Joe:  This was a year ago, 2020.

Trevor: Exactly a year ago, 2020. As soon as the shutdowns hit, what we started to see was about a twenty percent decrease in traffic overnight when the shutdown started. And what happened after that then it only took about three weeks for that traffic to bounce back. And so that was an initial shock in the early, early COVID. Hey, what's going to happen? Should I sell my house? Can I sell my house? Is it even safe? And then as people kind of got used to it a little bit or their pain was still there and they still needed to do something, they were still continuing to do the searches. Now I'm going to verbalize on the other side what happened. So this is conversions. And when we were talking last time on the podcast, Joe, I think it was probably March or April of last year during COVID, we were still in that phase where conversions were really, really low. And I'm going to be showing you guys a a couple of things. So pre-COVID in 2019, going into early 2020, we were seeing a consistent conversion rate that was pretty much consistent, all of 2019. And as the years have gone on and this is Carrot sites, non-Carrot sites, when the market gets continually hotter and you have more and more competition, your conversion rates of anything goes down. Right. If you're in a market and all of a sudden there's a lot more people doing direct mail, your conversion rates are going to go down. If if there's a lot more people doing text message marketing and using the same less, your conversion rate goes down eventually. And in general, in a hot market, when it's climbing, climbing, climbing, there's just a lot more competition. And conversion rates usually soften when the market starts to clear out, our conversion rates bounce back up again, which is pretty cool. But they've slowly, like, just kind of slowly edged towards a downward trend of last several years as the market got more and more competitive in all spots, not just Carrot sites, non-Carrot sites, the whole thing. And then when it hit, your conversion rates took a dip of about twenty-five percent and really never regained that spot. I mean, it's almost overnight. You can see the dip of conversion rates on the websites, buyers and sellers. It doesn't matter. And it was an overnight thing. It did pick up in the summer. So your conversion rates were starting to trend back up in the summer. You're going into July, going into August, September. And then when the new year started to hit around December, January, December, February, things like that, we started to see a softening during the during the holiday season, which happens anyway. There's almost always a softening of your conversion rates during the holiday season because there's still people searching, but they're like, oh, shoot, I might not want to sell right now, so I'm not going to give them the phone call. I'm going to put my information away, wait a little bit. And so what I'm to do now, Joe, is will bounce to the New Year and we'll pop it over here, go to the 29th. I think those dates are right there. And let's look at the trending now in the New Year. OK, so the trending in the New Year here is you can see users. So search traffic is very, very consistent this year so far, but it's consistently down a little bit from pre-COVID numbers, but still good. And now you can see conversion rate is just consistent, but edging a little bit lower still as the market gets hotter and hotter and hotter. Now, what does this mean? And I'll kind of tie it to somethinghere in a bit, on what's going to give you the better conversion rates up, what's up with the market gives you better conversion rate. What this means, guys, is their search volumes are still up. Conversion rates are lower for a few reasons. Number one, there's still some people from COVID that have chose to not sell yet. They're still wanting to wait and wait it out. I'm going to wait until this is done. So if you start to look at the dynamic in our markets of low inventory, high costs, there's a heavily low inventory of houses built this last decade, is looking at stack the other day where compared to previous decades where there was twenty million housing starts. This previous decade was only about five and a half to six million housing starts. And so we're way long on inventory because housing starts, contractors, and just people in general were scared to build mass developments like they were ramping up in the previous decade through 2008 or so. This last decade, 2021 through 2011, there hasn't been as many. So that's keeping inventories down. Number two, what's keeping inventories down is there are sellers on the sidelines who want to sell but are not selling it because of COVID. And so it's going to be interesting seeing as is there's these people, it's the delta, it's the people who are still searching and they have a problem but are not stepping forward to solve it. Those are going to unlock eventually. Those are going to unlock in the people who are going to win their investors who are staying in front of these sellers. It's the one who are staying in front of them with Google retargeting ads and credibility and building trust in authority. And they might not be opting out or calling you yet. But when they do, it's the investor that stays in front of them and has the most trust and credibility that's going to win that deal. And so while some people are dialing back, some of the marketing in spots, I would actually say as long as you're still getting your profitable numbers, keep the marketing there, knowing it's going to unlock, I think, in the next six to eight months and you're going to see a surge of demand of people ready to make those moves finally.

Joe:  Yeah, fascinating. I was looking at my Carrot site and I have a rent-to-own lease option website. I've had thirty-two visitors this week. Twelve leads this week. I think in the end, guys, I'm not I'm not I'm not the model for like how to optimize your website. I just use a plug and play what Carrot gives me. I think in the last I'll talk about my stats in a minute, but I think in the last year I've had over thirty-four hundred visitors, three thousand leads. And looking at the bottom of your site in the last month, guys, Carrot members have generated over sixty-five thousand leads. And here's the crazy thing. Sixty-five percent of them are from mobile devices.

Trevor: Yep. That's the big thing. And of those leads, none of those leads are phone call leads. So those leads that we're reporting, it's like the most conservative number we possibly have, which is only online, opt-in leads all the people that are calling the phone numbers at the top. And there's a good percentage of people that tapping the tap-to-call number on mobile. We track the tap-to-calls on our end, but we can't track it all the way through to say who actually initiatedfully and went through the call. But from surveys and stuff, you can probably take that number to sixty-five thousand leads that came in and add about fifty percent to that's another thirty and it puts it upwards of the eighty to ninety thousand leads a month when include phone call. It's significant. So one last thing here, Joe, that I'm a show that will go away from the data. We could dive into the data more if you want is, is you ask, well what type of marketing in this market. And it's not just this market, but it's every market cycle that we found so far. What type of marketing is going to get me a higher conversion? So I have to focus less time and energy on managing the leads. And as well as you guys and gals find in your business, one of the biggest things that we need to do in that we invest into is lead management. We have our CRM for lead management. We end up having acquisition managers or lead managers like VAs to handle all these leads. And what we found and also we've had tons of data reported back to us what kind of position in people's minds the conversion rate right now on different marketing types. Number one, radio and TV with about one in sixty leads into a deal. So it's mass marketing. You're getting it out there. It's kind of triggering some people. They're going to pick up the phone call or sometimes go to the website as well. About one in sixty of those end up turning into a deal. But the cool thing is you can get volume from radio and TV because you're hitting a lot of people at once. It's a high-leverage, low-conversion methodology. So number two, though, you've got cold calling, which is about the one in forty to one in sixty leads in with the same thing, very high-leverage, lower-conversion. As far as your marketing methodology, direct mail is about one in twenty to one in forty leads into a deal. So you send out a direct mail post, direct mail drop, they're going to get a bunch of mail. Pretty darn high leverage conversions lower than what I'm gonna show you here, but better than radio and TV. And so if you search is you start to look at this. I always like to look at my business model, Joe. I say, what does my business look like if we have to sift through sixty, seventy, eighty leads to get a deal? Well it means, I have to have more hires. It means there's probably to be more people involved in any means, potentially more hassle. And so going into a tight market, what I was like to look at, I say, what are the best leads? Like, how do I find the leads that are actually taking less energy? They're higher close ratio and higher profit margin. And one in eight to one in ten of these leads, the organic search leads closer to a deal. I'm talking sellers here, one in eight to one in ten. And then if we're talking Google pay-per-click, it's one in fifteen to one in twenty, one in twenty-five. And so if you start to look at I want to I want to challenge people, especially as you're seeing technologies like text message marketing potentially going away very soon. We start to go, what are we going to replace that with and how do we make sure that we're not getting locked into marketing? That creates an inconsistent business that stresses us out. Because if every twelve to eighteen months we're going after all the outbound marketing methods that are working today, it's the soup du jour. What's the marketing that's working right now in our market? Well, eight years ago it's direct mail. Everyone's cranking out direct mail and then direct mail rates start to go down as everyone was using the same list, marking those areas. What pops up after that? Well, it's cold calling. OK, cool. So the cold calling crew comes out and start to educate everyone on cold calling. No one was cold calling at that time. They crushing it now everyone's cold calling. Your response rates go a little bit down, as they say. What's next? Text message marketing. So text message marketing comes in about two years ago. Everyone starts text message marketing. It's great for the first twelve,eighteen months. Then two years later, it's go shoot, what's next? And so what's next? Guys, I want to challenge you guys on is the organic search side of things. Getting in front of Google searches for sellers and doing ads there is still insanely consistent. It's growing every quarter and it's not going to have this ebb and flow that outbound marketing has for you. And it converts twice as good on the traffic side.

Joe: So important. Yeah, I can't tell you how important that is because again, I'm looking at my stats and my numbers here and I've not done any kind of SEO intentional to for my rent-to-own lease options website in St. Louis. And I'm on the first page of Google at my Carrot site is and my stats again, like I just showed you, I don't remember my numbers right now, but like I'm getting leads because my stuff is out there, right. My current site is out there. It's just people are finding it. People are even finding my Facebook page, which redirects them, which leads them to my Carrot site. But this is so important. And Trevor, talk about this, the importance of just a little bit of investment now and how that pays dividends going forward. Yeah, you can get some leads right now by doing direct mail, text messaging, voice blasts, or bring this voice mail cold calling. But talk about the value of some seeds you plant now and how that can yield fruit for the next 15, 20 years.

Trevor: I'm going to show this so once again, for the for the YouTube viewers, you're going to get a little treat some eye candy here for the the podcast listeners I’m going to verbalize it. But one thing that we've been talking a lot with our big investors in the market, I'm going to show this one one slide here is this shift towards what we call Evergreen Marketing.

Joe:  And this is good. This is my point. I was trying to make.

Trevor: It so it's the shift towards Evergreen marketing. And Joe, you've known me for long. And if you've kind of seen I haven't talked about the mastermind this last week, I'm like consistent and predictability is what gets you that freedom. Consistent predictability is what it's what we all want. We say that we want it, but for some reason we don't give it to ourselves in our business. And I found years ago, man, that for me, consistency and predictability. Yes. Part of it's your business model. Right. Like if I'm wholesaling houses versus putting money into rental properties, your business model itself can give you more consistency or it can actually keep you on a hamster wheel. OK, so then that's where people can look at their business model and go, OK, how do I make my business model in-house with wholesaling or lease optioning more consistent one. No. One, you can follow Joe's training and do lease option and you can wholesale those lease options or you can keep them and collect the cash flow, which adds consistency. Or you can take your wholesale fees and put them into rental properties or put them into some other business model that's consistent, predictable, and it gains momentum over time. So that's the first thing to look at as your business model. Number two, though, within any business model, even wholesaling or flipping or wholesaling lease options is your marketing is we have to look at and say, what's the most consistent, predictable momentum building marketing I can do? That isn't just for getting leads this quarter, next quarter, but is actually positioning me to get momentum this year. And I can look back in two years and say, oh, shoot that work I did two years, actually gained momentum and is working for me today. And so when we look at this little graphic, it shows this up and down, this ebb and flow of the outbound marketing journey where you might look at the end of the year and your tax statement shows that you did a really good potentially. But then you look at your every single month and your stress the crap out because you don't really know what your marketing is going to do for you next month or next quarter. And so it's harder to hire. It's harder to plan ahead. It's stressful doing that. And I find so many flippers, wholesalers that get in the business two, three, four or five years. And then that grind, that ebb and flow, that lack of consistency is what drives them out if they didn't shift it. And so what we suggest people doing is we call it Evergreen Marketing and Hamster Wheel Marketing. Hamster Wheel Marketing is any outbound marketing that you do that you have to continually be on the hamster wheel to make it work. Right. So what Joe just talked about with this Carrot site, he did some set up originally. There's probably some work that was done originally and now some results are happening for him. Now, could he ramp those results up a little bit? For sure, if there are some more work done on it. But that's Evergreen Marketing. You do the work once and it happens, it works for you for years. Hamster Wheel Marketing, you do the work once and works for a very limited time period. It could be a day. If it's a social post, it could be six weeks. If it's a cold call campaign, then things are going to trickle out. It could be direct mail where that's three or four or five, six weeks. But what you guys need to focus on is how do we make the foundation of my business Evergreen Marketing, because that's going to make your foundation consistent and then you make your scale, so you scale up with your with your outbound, with your Hamster Wheel, where a lot of entrepreneurs kind of get caught is their foundation, is the hamster wheel marketing. And any time anything changes in the market or your text message marketing gets killed, now, your business, you go out of business or you get stressed. And that happens every every 12 to 18 months.

Joe: So, yeah, this is so important. Guys like if you could just learn to talk about your website more often in your podcasts, in your YouTube channels, in your social media, that stuff sticks around forever. And I said I wrote a chapter in Brunson's book, You Suddenly Lose. This is Russell Brunson from Click Funnels. You suddenly lose everything in 30 days. What would you do to go from from day one through 30? Right. And did you have did you have a chance to contribute to this term?

Trevor: I didn't, man. But there were some amazing, I bought the book and there's some awesome stuff in there, really.

Joe: All right. So one of the things I talked about and I also did this in I'm not trying to brag. It sounds like I am, I read another chapter for Russell Brunson's book in the Brick and Mortar Funnels, and I talked about in there in both of these about doing picking a niche and doing some social media stuff. And so specifically would be practically, putting this into practical terms is is let's say your niche is St. Louis real estate, St. Louis deals, St. Louis real estate or whatever. If you just started going in every day doing a little video, putting it on YouTube, Facebook, LinkedIn, Instagram and all of them, and talk about the St. Louis market, talk about buying deals and selling deals in St. Louis and just have on the bottom your video, your website and in you and you post that YouTube video up. I'm telling you guys, just doing the little things like that, being hyper focused, an inch wide and a mile deep, you're going to get so much traction. And those little investments as you're driving people to your website, your Carrot site is going to just drive that organic stuff. And that stuff lasts for a long time. When people start searching for how to sell my house fast, St. Louis or whatever, they're going to find your videos. They're going to find your pages that Google is seeing all of this going. And it takes a long, not a long time, but it's not instantaneous. It takes a while to see that goal. But when you start that, I'm telling you, six months later, a year later, two years later, you're going to see tons and tons of leads coming from that. What we're talking about, the flash in the pan, marketing is good. That gives you leads quick. But don't ignore the Evergreen Marketing. Right?

Trevor: That's the thing. The one thing that I've been talking with a lot of our high level and newer investors, Jow, is is really pulling back and asking ourselves, like, why the heck did we get into the business in the first place? And and most of when you talk to people, most of the time, it's very similar things. It's I want to get more freedom and more flexibility from my job. I don't have to clock in. I want to eliminate my income ceiling. I wanted to make a greater impact in those types of things. And so none of us had on that, none of us ever having the list, build a business that traps me. That's just what happens when we go, hey, I want these things, but then we don't walk it backwards and say, well, what business model and or what marketing will actually give me more freedom, give me more consistency, give me more predictability. And there might be a lot of people on here going, how am I going to compete against XYZ  other person or Joe or Trevor in a market when I'm just launching my site now? They've been there for three years. It doesn't matter. We have a lot of people in, let's say, Dallas, Texas, as an example. We had our we had our most recent Carrot camp in September. And these guys here, they're called the Home Buying Guys. These guys here, let me drag it over. I'm trying to think of their names. It's Lance and Lance and oh, my gosh, why am I blanking out.

Joe:   But yeah, that's all right.

Trevor: So they're awesome, the Home Buying Guys. But they are they were probably customer number one hundred and thirty-fifth in the Dallas market. And they were there way after other guys like Brian Rockwool and other case studies we've had in that market. And they just executed our plan. They just said, well, even though there's a lot of people that are doing online marketing that market, how do we stand out? And that's the biggest thing that people need to do now, because now we have ibuyers that we're directly competing with. And those ibuyers, I don't know if you guys started to see the last six months, we predicted two years ago said the ibuyers are going to become brokerages or they're going to start to partner with people and they are going to not only just make offers, they're going to also get people in the listings. If you look on Open Door today, they specifically say now we will list or buy your house, unless that was just a split test and then also offer pad, we will list or buy your house. That's not if you look at Keller Williams, you look at eXp all those, they are now going out there and building i buyer programs like they have the last year and Zillow is now a brokerage. And so three years ago I started to say the real retail in the wholesale market are going to start to mash together and you have to be both or you have to work with the other. If you're an investor, you have to also be an agent. Have a license or work with somebody so you can take those eighty percent of your leads that are not going to fit the box of a cash offer and help those sellers through the retail side and collect those commissions. And there's a lot of people who are going to say, man, I don't want to get my license, or my coach told me not to, which is valid. Right. Once you get your license, there's a higher code of ethics you've got to stand to and there's some things you have to do. But I can guarantee you guys, especially in a competitive market right now, if you go to market and you are just serving up a cash offer and you don't have the whole gamut of things to offer, you're going to be losing deals. And number two is in a competitive market like in Dallas or Denver or wherever else, there's probably going to be three, four or five or six other investors and agents that that seller is likely going to be talking to if they're seeking out a solution. And when you start to look at that, if you start to look at it, number one, yeah, your website marketing should hit the basics. Hey, you tell them that you have a service that can solve their problem. That's like basic table stakes. You need to sell your house in Dallas Fort Worth? Cool. I have a service that can offer that can help you there. Hey, you want to sell your house in Tacoma? Awesome. I can help you with that. So check that box table stakes. Tell them you have a service. But number two, what's going to happen next is they're going to then vet and verify you. They're going to say, who is this guy or gal? They're going to say, are they experience? And then start to go through your website and look at your credibility. Like I'm showing the visuals of this for those of you watching the YouTube version, but showing how Keith, one of our customers, he does eight to ten deals a month, most of them through online, through Carrot, how he's building credibility. Joe, if you were to look at his site versus the average investor site, even the average Carrot member site, Keith is going to win those deals all day long because he's got so much more credibility on there. Videos with sellers. He's got before and afters of some of the flips they've done. He has lots of credibility and testimonials all over the place. You look in the reviews page, he's got videos everywhere, and it's Keith with that seller, Keith with that seller, Keith shaking the hand. Keith is a nice guy. It's like Keith, Keith's wearing a vest. He must be a nice guy if he's wearing a vest. Right. And so that's that's the market we're in right now, guys, is you're still going to get your higher performance, your highest margin deals, your most motivation from people who are seeking out a solution, which is Google search. But to stand out for any marketing you're doing, even if you don't give a crap about getting ranked in Google, we have to be building our credibility profile right now.

Joe: Somebody looking at this on YouTube or watching this is like, OK, that looks nice, but oh my gosh, I have to build all that myself. Like, I have no idea where to start looking at those other guys you just mentioned, the guys in Dallas, our website here. This is obviously a Carrot site, but they've got a lot of good content and they're looking at this one. You're also mentioning I'm just looking at the Home Buying Guys here. It just looks really slick and nice and fancy and somebody who doesn't have any clue with technology, like, how do I do this? Is it really point and click and I'm giving you a softball here.

Trevor: No, for sure. I mean, at the end of the day. So there's going to be work. And this is something that I tell people is you can either work your butt off for the next X amount of years, three, four or five, six, seven, ten years doing Hamster Wheel Marketing. And every twelve to eighteen months, you get a shift, your strategy and it goes new emergency moment. Or you can work your butt off the next two to six months, building up your Evergreen Marketing. And so kind of what we say, Joe, is this is your first there's something we call the 2-6-1 Formula. The first two months, I'll see if I can find the slide, but the first two months is going to be a good bit of work. It's going to be building what we call your authority hub. It's getting a Carrot site launched. It's getting your reviews up there. It's getting some good content up there and a good About page. And it might take you a whole day or two days maybe, depending how fast you do that or how readily available you have that content. Getting your logo on there. If you have one, if you're brand new and you're like, man, how am I going to compete? I don't have any reviews yet. It doesn't matter. Just make people love you, like make people love you at first. And as you get those reviews, then put them on there. So the first couple of months, you're probably going to be three or four hours a week, maybe max diving into our training, doing some of the work, adjusting things and starting to do the content SEO and maybe launch your first paid ads. And then about month six, Joe, is where you start to then see some some results happen. That's where you start to see things pop on Google. That's where you start to see some rankings pop. And that's, that's also where you're probably going to see that first leader to come in around that time period, maybe a lead a month at that time, maybe a lead every other week at that time, depending on your market. But then here's where it gets cool is right around the year period. That's where momentum picks up with evergreen marketing because it's kind of seeded in there. And a lot of people get in that three to six, three to eight month mark, Joe, that's where a lot of people get defeated. They go, oh, my gosh, I've been doing the work, I've been doing the work, but I'm not seeing the result. And they get back on the hamster wheel because it's eye candy. It's like I'm going to get rolling in this thing. And if you just stick through that month six, stick through that month, they implement the plan. A couple hours a week, you're going to start to see really a bunch of momentum from month six to twelve. And like the guys down in Dallas, it took them about eight months, and now they do hundreds of thousands of dollars per month right now, oftentimes, and most of that's through Carrot, if not all of it through SEO and Google pay per click. Keith, now he does eight to 10 deals a month and most of those are through this. But it took him about a year to get that momentum. Consistency, consistency,

Joe: Consistency is the key. And you need a you need a website. You need the credibility. Nobody does it better than Carrot. Cool. Trevor, what do you guys got working on in the horizon?

Trevor: Yeah, so there’s some cool things. The first the first thing, Joe, is we’ve been hot and heavy on hybrid for like two or three years, and especially now that the market is low on selling inventory agents or real estate agents is something that we are, we’ve been working with agents for a couple of years. But now if you’re an agent or an investor, the hybrid model is going to be key to be able to compete against the buyers and against the brokerages. Now, they’re going to be hybrid, a hybrid model.

Joe:  What do you mean by hybrid model?

Trevor For US hybrid models, more of a sellers strategy. So it's someone who's an investor and has their license. Or you could be an investor, but you're collaborating with someone who has the real estate license. So you don't have to get it, but you have to find a way to take those seller leads that come through. And about 80 percent of the sellers don't want your your discount cash offer. They want retail. So then the 20 percent, you're going to be able to kind of engage in those 20 percent and hopefully make a purchase or use creative financing like Joe teaches to increase your odds of making a deal. But then the 80 percent most sellers are most investors are throwing those leads away. You're completely throwing them in the trash. And so hybrid is going to be big. And we've got some cool things rolling out in hybrid, a hybrid website we rolled out a couple of months ago. We've got some great training on hybrid on how to really ramp up your sellers, then take those leads that are not wholesale worthy and put them over here to the agent side to add income stream. And then another thing, we're doubling down on big time, Joe, is, man, you saw when we were at the mastermind. We're investing about a million dollars extra this year in product development. So we're going to how do we make our SEO tools better? How do we make the designs on Carrot even better, ramping up our split testing? We've already started roll things out on sites even this quarter that make conversion rates even higher like we've been doing for years. So we've got some really cool product stuff coming out for sure.

Joe: I was just looking at my podcast website, realestatemastery.com, and thinking that it'd be nice to get a redesign for this. Do you have a podcast, website templates?

Trevor It's so funny because there's a guy he's, he runs the podcast lab coat agents in the real estate agent market, one of the biggest communities over there. And so Jeff Fizer, he's actually moving his personal brand branded website over to Carrot and he's going to dive in and do all this stuff. The problem is, if you want to make it look like Lewis House's website or something, our system just isn't set up for that. We're direct response. Eliminate the clutter, but make or eliminate the fluff, make a high converting, so Jeff's moving over to it. But we don't officially have like a podcast site. I use Carrot, Joe, for my personal sites. So TrevorMauch.com is on carrot and then I use it for my Airbnbs and for my rental properties. That's why I use it for.

Joe: Nice. All right. Thank you so much, Trevor, for being on the show. And again, guys, I like carrots. I really do. JoeLikesCarrots.com. I get a little commission when you buy a Carrot site. But I've been recommending you guys for years and years. And it's there's, there's just nobody else that does it. Like you guys do as good as you do it. And you've got websites for motivated sellers, for buyers, for lenders, for land deals, buying and selling land. You've got websites for agents, lease options. Anything else? I forgot. I mean, you got a bunch of them here.

Trevor: There's a mobile home one, I've some other ones. But the land was funny. If anyone was to literally Google “sell my land” at the national level, the number one ranking result is a site at the national level. I guy brings in probably two to three thousand land seller leads every single every single year through that. That one's that one page.

Joe: Yeah, I love it. All right, guys, you can check Trevor out. Also, at carrot.com if you want to go directly to the site. You guys have a podcast. How do people find that?

Trevor: Carrotcast. Go to carrot.com/Trevor. That’s kind of where everything is so linked to the Carrotcast over there. You were recently on the Carrotcast, which was fun. And what we do in that man is to, two times a week, once a week is an interview with one of our customers or some of my favorite authors. Greg McKewon from Essentialism. Oh, yeah, he was on the podcast. So my favorite authors, we get on. And then the second one, I actually borrowed this from you. I just kind of recording. You had the the podcast you you’re doing in your car for a while. Yeah. So I still do that about 80, 80 or 90, what I call Trevor truck talks in. Oh cool. Those are always on my drive home. They’re usually sub ten to 15 minutes, from the heart. What I’m going through as an entrepreneur and those are the ones that get the most responses and, and ratings and people DMing me because it’s always mindset stuff. It’s stuff as an entrepreneur that you’re going through that I wade you through my own journey as well, so check out the Carrotcast, but go to carrot.com/Trevor for access to all that. Find me on IG over there as well.

Joe:  Are you active on IG?

Trevor: Yeah. I mean, pretty active. Active compared to Grant Cardone? No, but yes, I do update things on stories weekly and sometimes

Joe: More than me. That's awesome. It's been a short podcast, but we started late. I know you got a deadline you got to get out to. But Trevor, thank you so much for being on the show.

Trevor: I appreciate you, man. And one thing I want to I want to finish with this, guys, I've known Joe for many, many years and the community that you guys are in right now with Joe, you guys are going to have everything you need to succeed. I've seen Joe succeed over and over again year after year, and one of the most honest ethical dudes that I know and just knows his stuff. So the one thing I would suggest for people to do is lock into one mentor for that first 90 days, 120 days, six months, and just dive deep in their rabbit hole. I don't go to the Carrotcast until you've gone through everything's on Joe's and implemented it. And you guys are in the right spot. So grateful for a man and being that beacon of positivity and possibility for the, for the industry.

Joe: I appreciate that. I really, really do. And I also I forgot to mention this. Your blog on your website is really good. I'm opening it up here. You had some fascinating articles on there. You analyzed fifty-plus Google ad accounts, and you showed where the top twenty motivated seller keywords are. You have a new and improved carrott IDX which allows people to show properties that are listed on the MLS. There you have some data blog posts about how a 50 percent increase in motivated seller leads came from one simple test. Nine real estate business models to consider when rising interest rates with rising interest rates or when inventories are low. Ten ways to audit your Google ads during covid. And something similar to what we talked about here, where over two hundred thousand buyer and seller leads came from. In the last three months, six data driven ways to generate more motivated seller leads online. There's a whole blog post talking about Evergreen Marketing, which we just did here. Best practices for real estate, investor websites. Four real estate website, pitfalls that can kill your lead generation. Twenty nine real estate agent, marketing ideas to generate more stellar leads online like. Come on.

Trevor:  Oh, there's good stuff over there, man.

Joe: This is really good for sure. So I appreciate you being on the show. Trevor, I want to guys, just encourage you to go check out the carrotcast website. The podcast is where a lot of good stuff on there. Cool. We'll see you soon. Trevor. I'm sure we got some mastermind that we're going to be at sometime soon.

Trevor: Dude, I'm always pumped about my Joe McCall time man. So I appreciate this time with you today, dude, and is an amazing pleasure to hang out with you this week. And I'm sure we'll see sometime this year in person again.

Joe:  All right. Sounds good to see you guys. Everybody take care.